New Nasdaq Fees (Echo vs. Bright)

Discussion in 'Prop Firms' started by esc_trader, Feb 25, 2002.

  1. vsisto

    vsisto ECHOtrade

    Cashonly has got it right. Esc Trader, remember that Redi and Realtick are front ends and that you must tell the front-end where you want your order routed in the fragmented mess called Nasdaq. It is confusing because Redi is the name of the SLK front end and the ECN. You should never have an Island order given a "look" by another ECN. Like Cashonly noted, the Arca and Redi ECN's (which have recently merged) have selectnet features which allow them to trade with the Nasdaq system (market makers and other ECN's) but which are slower than trading with the ECN directly. They do offer the advantages, though, of market orders, which other ECN's don't.

    Randomwalker, thank you for the head's up on the traders lurking in the listed Level II's. I have recently started to keep my level II up for the listed stocks I trade since more and more bids and offers are beginning to pop up (never really with any size, though.)

    As far as the Island adding liquidity rebate, it is a real rebate that the Island offers. Clearing firms typically pocket this but I'm sure if Echo is receiving it, other firms are soon to follow.
    #11     Feb 25, 2002
  2. vsisto-
    thanx for the this why when I had Realtick and used ARCA sometimes I wouldn't see the order come up on level2 for 15-20 seconds? That was always a real pain...then I just started using Island and never had a problem...but I hate the fact that you can't put stops and trailing stops on Island

    Does Bright rebate the Island orders?

    And how does Bright feel about the RedI-Arca merger?
    I know in one seminar Bright said ARCA wasn't a "true ECN" how does this merger effect traders? Are Bright traders gonna move to not using REDI?
    #12     Feb 25, 2002
  3. Thanks for the tip random. Using ISLD on listed stocks can be profitable! I do use L2s to see this..
    For instance, in a weak stock NYSE showing 30.40 x 30.50 and sometimes ISLD will pop in with a bid at 30.49. I hit em immediately for whatever size they are showing. Wouldn't have been able to get into that going to NYSE. It doesn't happen all that often but when it does I jump on it. Today, I was in CA long and was moving against me - hitting the bid on NYSE I would have been -.15, good old ISLD comes in and got out only -.04 Whew!
    #13     Feb 25, 2002
  4. ericdh


    How much do they charge for level 2?

    Also, for clarity, Bright does not have direct ecn access except to Redi correct? Isld, arca, brut, mxt, inca are hit thru redi algorithm then?
    #14     Feb 25, 2002
  5. vsisto

    vsisto ECHOtrade

    I'm sure Don Bright is around here somewhere and can answer the questions on his firm specifically, but as far as the merger is concerned, its a win for all. Two liquid books are now becoming even more liquid books. The new ARCA ECN is something to be reckoned with. The losers in this transaction are not the traders, but Instinet and Island. Our traders are very comfortable with ARCA.
    #15     Feb 25, 2002
  6. It's like $20 a month or so, I think it is cheap, if you take into account that at least once a day, I am able to get in or out of a listed position, at a better price than using NYSE

    AS far as I know and based on what happens to the orders I send, the ISLD orders go straight to ISLD, and I think Redi ECN is not active on listed stocks during normal market hours.
    The only other ECN that shows up on L2 for listed is ARCA, and always way outside of the market.
    As for the other ECNS on OTC stocks, I really don;t know, I only trade listed and indexes

    Aftter hours, REDi usually has better prices and size than ISLD on listed stocks.

    #16     Feb 25, 2002
  7. FYI, REDI trading hours are:
    QQQ,SPY, DIA and NASDAQ stocks: 7:30am-8:00pm
    Listed stocks:7:30am-9:15am and 4:00pm-8:00pm

    I know ISLD, ARCA and INCA all trade listed during normal market hours, in addition to pre and post market as well. I'm not sure if MKXT,NTRD,BRUT,BTRD and ATTN trade listed stocks. If anyone knows, please post.
    #17     Feb 25, 2002
  8. cashonly

    cashonly Bright Trading, LLC

    L2 is $50/mo.

    Bright DOES have direct ECN access on ISLD, ARCA, INCA, and REDI. Don't think it's avail for BRUT or MXT, but can't say for certain.
    #18     Feb 25, 2002
  9. Does Bright rebate the Island orders?

    No, but their Nasdaq pricing is still solid.

    And how does Bright feel about the RedI-Arca merger?
    I know in one seminar Bright said ARCA wasn't a "true ECN" how does this merger effect traders? Are Bright traders gonna move to not using REDI?

    No, we don't rebate Island orders, and we don't charge for using Island.

    Island has sent me their pricing, including rebate program for "adding liquidity" ...but since we don't charge for their use anyway, we don't get the rebate...why pay .25 to get back .10 on some orders (actually .0025, and .0010 for you "nitpickers" ) :)

    As I posted earlier, the RediArca merger is great....Server "Farms" nationwide, more bandwidth, better book Vito said "win win"..

    The scoop on ARCA (not being a "true ECN")....ARCA does have MM's who use the ARCA "give up" and post bids and offers like any MM, and have the ability to "fade" at times....a "true ECN" does not give that ability.
    #19     Feb 26, 2002
  10. Gee whiz, Jeff and the people at Echo could have at least asked before xeroxing our price schedules....a little "spin" action on the remote schedule...but for Gosh sakes, stealing my Lincoln Head penny from years ago is down right mean!!

    Why did it take 2 months to duplicate it? You didn't even take that long to duplicate our traders agreement. We may have well have simply made additional copies and saved the copying fees at Kinko's.....

    (The above is all good natured teasing, I was just quoting one of our traders who visits your website). Hey, "....sincerest form of flattery"...and all that..

    Good Luck!!! (Just being sociable)....

    Another note: We don't charge the ECN pass throughs at all? And the stuff about "multiple platforms" is ok, but we (and most) prefer Redi / Arca anyway. Rates are fair to all concerned.

    (I figure we can save our elite friends a lot of time comparing apples to oranges)...:)

    #20     Feb 26, 2002