WTF? That is not my argument. Are you some sort of low thinking anti science troll? My argument is that you better hope we can naturally develop antibodies which neutralize Omicron. You do realize vaccines (at least in large part) rely on our natural ability to develop neutralizing antibodies?
Great to come back and see GWB still lying and DEAD FUCKING WRONG about ALL things covid. Years later. Check out Sweden!
South Africa or Africa itself is fucked...poor healthcare, other prevalent deadly diseases (e.g. HIV/AIDS, Malaria and Tuberculosis), a high number of people that are immune-compromise from those other prevalent deadly diseases, and then the low vaccination rates to Covid... Natural Immunity to Covid will never be possible there because of the above and due to Omicron's ability to evade natural immunity and evade vaccine defenses...although the latter mild illness. Instead, it's a country that's a perfect breathing ground for Variants of Concerns. --------- Early evidence presented by the researchers suggests the risk of coronavirus reinfection increased threefold between the beginning of October and the end of November, the period when scientists believe the new variant was on the rise. https://www.scmp.com/news/china/sci...stantial-ability-evade-natural-immunity-south ---------- All we can do now is slow down the spread of Omicron (we can not stop it) so that we can learn more about it. Arguing about it before the science of the spread is released in a few weeks is just stupidity. Now go enjoy your Christmas shopping and get ready for Christmas. wrbtrader
Oh you mean Sweden that just instituted a vaccine passport system to keep the unvaccinated out of public venues. Or do you mean the Sweden where the Parliament voted in 2021 to give the federal government broad powers to lockdown the country for Covid or other disease. Or do you mean the Sweden where both the former Prime Minister and King stated their early Covid "natural immunity" policy was a complete failure. Or do you mean the Sweden where the Prime Minister was replaced in 2021 due to his earlier failures to properly address Covid when it appeared in the country. Or do you mean the Sweden which had 10X the Covid deaths of its direct neighbors while its economy performed worse than its direct neighbors. Or do you mean the Sweden that reverted to broadly using restrictions to address Covid when its initial policies failed miserably. Or do you mean the Sweden that recently praised neighbor Norway for have the best Covid response in the region. Yeah... tell us what Sweden you are yammering about.
You talking about the social-democratic government of Sweden that finally got their shit together about Covid. The same Sweden that its czar of Natural Immunity policy (Anders Tegnell) decided to get fully vaccinated and tell the citizens to do their civil duty to protect the country by getting fully vaccinated too... Oh...that Sweden. wrbtrader
You are just continuously spewing anti-vax Covid-denier terminology and misinformation. Let's take a look at your recent regurgitation of misinformation. '"Experts" were still pushing the lie that the vaccinated could not be infected' WRONG - Experts stated from the beginning that there would be vaccinated breakthrough cases. Covid vaccines are seeing a mere 0.5% vaccinated breakthrough rate in an environment with high prevalence of the disease. For a comparisn the measles and mumps vaccines have a vaccinated breakthrough rate of over 3% in populations where the disease is highly prevalent. Covid vaccinations do serve to stop transmission and infections -- which means the unvaccinated are a greater threat for getting infected (seeing that over 90% of the cases are unvaccinated and thus transmitting the disease. "The biggest source of dangerous variants are the high risk whose natural immune systems can not clear the virus giving the virus time to incubate and mutate." NO - The greatest risk are the unvaccinated who account for over 90% of the cases and hospitalizations (severe cases). As noted by experts nearly all the new variants are generated in the unvaccinated -- only a minuscule number of variants are generated in vaccinated people who are immune compromised. Your claim is not supported in any manner with data or science regarding Covid when comparing vaccinated and unvaccinated population in regards to variant generation. "ADE" -- Oh, you are pushing anti-vaxxer ADE nonsense. It is laughable. ADE is not a problem with Covid vaccines -- this ADE crap is typical misinformation pushed by anti-vaxxers. At this point it serves as a marker to identify people who are pushing complete bullshiat in their Covid commentary. Congrats you are a winner. "Neutralizing antibodies" -- yet another anti-vaxxer buzzword being pushed as misinformation linked to "natural immunity" these days. Congrats on winning again for pushing buzzwords of anti-vaxxers -- which merely serves to identify you are pushing the stuff that comes out of a bull. "Natural immunity to Omicron" -- Yeah, when all the initial data shows that re-infections are very high with Omicron you are pushing "natural immunity". And yes, as all the press from South Africa has stated over 90% of the hospitalized are unvaccinated with Omicron (similar to other variants). Your claim that "how do you know that these cases are Omicron" is pure misinformation when those regions of South Africa are showing nearly 100% of the cases in the area are Omicron. In summary -- for over a year we have debunked most of the nonsense you are pushing with proper studies, science and data. Yet -- here you are spewing all this nonsense again. Go back and read the previous posts to educate yourself on reality.
In other news -- the breakout on the Norwegian cruise ship was likely started by a crew member from South Africa who just came on board. His case is probably Omicron and the other cases may be as well -- though this is not proven yet. This is concerning because 100% of the people on a cruise ship are vaccinated and this outbreak infected 17 people. If this is Omicron then it is a sign that this variant is vaccine evasive. The only good news being that all the cases are mild. Suspected Omicron case aboard Norwegian cruise ship is South African crew member https://www.reuters.com/business/he...nd-aboard-cruise-ship-new-orleans-2021-12-06/ A South African crew member suspected of having the Omicron variant of COVID-19 is among the 17 cases of the virus detected on a cruise ship that disembarked in New Orleans over the weekend, the cruise line said on Monday. U.S. officials are closely monitoring the latest variant, which has been detected in at least a third of states, to try to ascertain its severity amid a rise in COVID-19 cases in recent weeks. read more Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings Ltd (NCLH.N) said the crew member on the Norwegian Breakaway vessel was in isolation for the entirety of the cruise that departed New Orleans on Nov. 28 carrying more than 3,200 individuals and made stops in Belize, Honduras and Mexico. Louisiana health officials said all passengers were tested for COVID-19 before leaving the ship, and those who tested positive would either travel to their residence in a personal vehicle or self-isolate in accommodations provided by Norwegian Cruise Line. As they disembarked on Sunday, some passengers said they were not alerted about the outbreak while on board. "I mean, they tested everybody yesterday, but they didn't tell us," passenger Frank Sousla told NBC. "I found out on Facebook, and I think it's extremely irresponsible." At the start of the pandemic, outbreaks on ships prompted U.S. health officials to suspend cruising, leading to billion-dollar losses. The rollout of COVID-19 vaccines, combined with pent-up demand for leisure travel, have helped the industry rebound since sailing resumed this summer. Last month, Norwegian Cruise Line forecast a return to profitability in the second half of 2022. Shares of Norwegian rose 12% on Monday, the highest percentage gain in more than a year. read more All major cruise operators departing from U.S. ports, including Norwegian Cruise Lines, require guests and crew to be fully vaccinated. Norwegian also requires all guests with cruise embarkation dates through Jan. 16, 2022 to take a COVID-19 antigen test prior to boarding. Passengers agree to accept the risks including death from traveling during the pandemic, according to Norwegian's ticket, which recommends guests seek the advice of a doctor before boarding. The contract also specifically says passengers accept the risks of new COVID variants. For the cruise line to be liable for any injuries caused by the outbreak, plaintiffs would have to prove Norwegian did not take reasonable care to protect passengers, said Martin Davies, the director of the Maritime Law Center at Tulane University in New Orleans. "I’m not sure what else they could have done," said Davies, pointing to Norwegian's vaccination and testing requirements for passengers and staff. The cruise line said in its statement on Monday that passengers who sailed on the Breakaway's next trip that left on Sunday "must wear masks while indoors except while actively eating or drinking and will be tested twice during the cruise." Fully vaccinated guests are not required to wear masks, except on European cruises, according to Norwegian policy. The Breakaway outbreak is smaller than others recorded in recent months by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which said an increase in cruise travel has led to COVID-19 cases among passengers and crew members despite high vaccination rates in both groups. From June 26 to Oct. 21, there were 1,359 confirmed coronavirus cases reported to the CDC by cruise ships, including several large outbreaks. There have been instances of passengers who denied being symptomatic or waited several days to report symptoms, the health agency said. One fully vaccinated passenger who was symptomatic for COVID-19 but denied having symptoms died three days after boarding for reasons related to the virus, according to the CDC.
As noted earlier Norway is tightening restrictions again to deal with Omicron -- which will avoid these large gatherings. This outbreak appears to be triggered by a guest who just returned from South Africa. Seeing that previous natural infection provides nearly zero protection against being infected with Omicron (as noted in South Africa media) -- it is not surprising that vaccination is less effective at stopping inection as well. The good news being that all the cases are mild -- so vaccination still appears to be effective in stopping severe illness. We should also note that over 90% of the Omicron cases hospitalized in South Africa are unvaccinated. A Christmas party in Norway becomes a possible Omicron-spreading event https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/03/world/omicron-norway-christmas-party.html Around half of the people who attended an office Christmas party in Oslo, where only vaccinated employees were admitted, have tested positive for the coronavirus after one guest recently returned from South Africa was found to carry the new Omicron variant, local health authorities said on Friday. More than 120 people attended the event, held a week ago by a solar power company. Of the positive tests sequenced so far, between 15 and 20 were likely to be the Omicron variant, according to Dr. Tine Ravlo, a local chief physician involved in tracking the outbreak, who added that not all of the 60 coronavirus cases found so far had yet been fully checked for the variant. “We are expecting more of them to likely be Omicron infections,” she said. A spokesman for the company, Scatec, said that only vaccinated staff had been admitted to the party, and everyone had tested negative for the coronavirus before the event. The party was held at a restaurant called Louise in central Oslo on Nov. 26, the same day that the World Health Organization labeled Omicron a “variant of concern” and many countries started closing their borders to passengers from southern Africa, where it was first identified. The variant carries mutations that scientists say could allow it to spread more quickly and to cause more breakthrough infections, though much remains uncertain. Cases have now been reported in more than 40 countries, including in the United States. The Scatec spokesman, Stian Tvede Karlsen, said that the employee first found to have the variant had arrived back in Norway from visiting a regional office in Cape Town before news of the variant had come out. In order to curb further spread of the variant, the Norwegian government announced on Thursday additional restrictions in and around Oslo. Enforcement started at midnight. They include the obligation to wear masks anywhere that social distance cannot be maintained, including on subways and buses or in shops; a return to working from home if possible; and a cap on crowds of 100 people, except at theaters and other places with fixed seats, where up to 600 can be present. Only table service is permitted for alcoholic drinks, and restaurants and events need to register guests.