My ideas to solve the immigration problem

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by bigarrow, May 20, 2007.

  1. Immigration plan:

    Define the problem:
    ) Illegal immigrants (the majority being Mexicans) are coming to America mainly for job opportunities and for government benefits and most importantly for hope for a better life.

    Define the cause of the problem:
    ) Mexican workers wanting to earn a better living for their families and themselves.
    ) American employers wanting lower cost of labor.
    ) American citizens wanting lower cost of products and services.

    Cost of illegal immigration to Americans:
    ) Local communities spend $ millions each year on services for illegal workers.
    ) County and state governments spend $ billions each year on health care and welfare costs.
    ) The cost to the federal government may be larger than both the above once social security is figured into the equation.
    ) The hardest hit is the cost to the blue collar American workers whose wages are driven down by the illegal workers.

    Popular proposed solutions:
    ) Build a fence and ship all the illegal immigrants back to Mexico.
    ) Keep the workers and have a path to citizenship similar to plan before congress now.

    Problems with above solutions:
    ) Neither solutions solve the problem they only address the symptoms.
    ) It is probably close to impossible logistically, financially and politically to bus all the illegal workers back home.
    ) The plan before congress is like the Reagan plan – the end result is nothing changes.

    The illegal immigration problem is simply a supply and demand problem. All proposals now on the table fail to address this problem. In a free society as ours, it is close to impossible to stop willing employers from hiring willing employees. Our history with drug prohibition is an example of the limits of laws in a large free society.

    My proposed solution:

    Work on solving the cause of the problem:
    Main causes:
    ) Lack of decent jobs in Mexico
    ) Lack of punishment on employers and citizens who employ illegals

    American outsources $100's billions of dollars in goods and services now. Most of the call centers seem to be in India.
    ) Start call center training schools in America for illegal Mexican workers
    ) The call center is just one small example of business that would work on this program. Of course it would take many others to entice millions of Mexicans back home.
    ) Help start up finance loans for business in Mexico to hire these workers
    I know the main argument is why should we pay to train the Mexican workers. Answer - we are spending the money now on them and it will be an endless cost for years. In time the workers who go back to Mexico will translate into saved dollars for local, state and federal governments which equals less of our tax dollars spent.
    ) No workers who sign up for this program will be punished by fines or restrictions on future American citizenship. In fact preferential treatment may be given to these workers who go through the training and go back to there country on future citizenship.

    I know the main argument from the right is they are breaking the law lets punish them. But this will not solve or stop the problem. We can build a fence along the boarder though and this would not affect this program and help slow down (maybe) the flow of illegal workers and appease some of the voters.
    The other argument is we can't afford this. Well folks we are spending the money now in health care and social services and lower wages to our legal workers.
    Another argument is why should we train illegal workers when we aren't training ours. Fair, but unless we work to solve the illegal worker problem the lower end jobs won't pay enough to live above the poverty level.
    Arguments from the left are they are here helping build America so they should be able to stay. They are working for low wages to help America and Americans. This is true but our main responsibility is to people who are citizens now. And the democratic party should walk the walk and help the working poor citizens in America. The easiest way to do this is to remove illegal workers which will raise the demand for the working poor = a pay raise.
    And the best way to remove illegal workers is to have them leave of their own will and for the ones still in Mexico have jobs there so they don't want to leave.

    I believe this plan can help ( not stop ) the illegal worker problem and help the working poor in America and help Mexico and the citizens of Mexico. A financially strong Mexico is good for America. This would be a win win win solution to the problem.

    Draw backs to this proposed solution:
    ) It does nothing to solve the problem now. It is a long term solution that can take years to see the results. But I think it is unreasonable to think there is a quick fix to the immigration problem.
    ) Getting the fanatics on both sides to come together for a common sense solution. Both sides need to lighten up on the other side and work on solving the problem. I think if the problem can be put as a human issue and a supply and demand problem this could be a start.

    This is a very rough draft of my ideas to solve the immigration problem and I realize there are many problems with this working. But it seems like the best solution so far.
  2. You're assuming American business hires illegals based on "cost".
    I'd argue the truth is far deeper. There's not enough American's at any reasonable price to fill these jobs.

    Europe has the same problem. So does Canada. White's are at ZERO growth. So Europe imports Turk's, Canada Asians and we allow Mexican's.

    If you open a huge hotel in Vegas or Miami do you think you have an easy time find a hospitality staff? Maids? Busboys? Even the unemployed black teenager in L.A. doesn't move to Vegas with the hope of cleaning toilets. And times are going to get pretty tough before an outsourced techie brings himself to bus your salad plate in some hotel dining room.

    How many white kids in well educated Iowa are looking to haul grain in a feedlot? Back when American families pumped out five kids each, pardon the expression, no problemo.

    As a race we're dying. As is the car owner preaching the evil's of global warming , unless you've sired your "quota" of two or three kids you're part of the problem.

    Do any of you tell your kid's, study hard so you can grow up and be a migrant farm worker?

    Absent complete protectionism from the competition of cheaper made foreign products, it's completely ridiculous to think business is going to pay American worker's above scale when American consumer's won't pay extra even to save American jobs.
  3. BSAM


    My idea to solve the immigration problem: ENFORCE THE LAWS OF THE UNITED STATES.
  4. I agree with a lot of what you're saying about the macro side of this, but I am right in cost being a large part of equation. As far as American's paying above scale, we are setting scale artificially low by allowing so many illegal workers here. The illegal workers here in America aren't competing with China or Indonesia or where ever. These are service jobs not manufacturing jobs. The Chinese can't come here to compete on those jobs. The illegals are competing against American workers. Where I live there is a reason that a smart hard working young man goes to the oil field instead of framing houses. Both are physical jobs but the oil field pays at least twice what construction does. The industries that can pay can get good clean cut Americans to do the job, even when the job involves physical labor. And I'm not saying that we don't need Mexican workers at all, we do and a lot of them. But we do need a way to control the influx of workers. Just making sure that payroll taxes were paid would be a big improvement.

    BSAM - I don't think this problem is solved by punishing people, just like the drug laws don't stop drug use or sales. Some things can't be controlled by laws and this may be one of them. And Pabst is right we need a lot of the workers here to get the work done. The problem is what is the best way to accomplish our goals, and more importantly to define our goals.
  5. give them amnesty but give US, in exchange, rock bottom rates on five star beach front hotels!! come on let's work a deal man.. we give you minimum wage you give us beach front.. deal??
  6. To everyone who says just enforce the laws, try this. The next time you need a roof replaced tell the bidding contractors you need proof that all the workers are legal and all withholding taxes and workers comp is paid on all workers. Then pay that extra $2000+ the roof will cost out of your pocket, because the insurance co. will not pay the difference. This is one way an individual can do his part to stem illegal workers, albeit a very expensive way.
  7. gosh... how did we ever exist in the 50's ???? oh me oh my.
  8. To quote Glenn Reynolds, "They (politicians) seem to regard the law on the books as a sort of opening bid...."

    That's one of the main things that has people so infuriated with this latest sham of an immigration bill. The scum in Washington, Dem & Republican, pass bills in order to free themselves from having to do anything difficult or principled. If current law doesn't serve their gutless, arrogant, self-dealing ways, well hey just change the law - it's that easy.
  9. thank you all dreamers and what ever for all this entertainment..

  10. If your roof is leaking, the first thing you do is patch the leak. Then you worry about cleaning up the water damage and replacing the carpets.

    If we begin by building the fence that has already been authorized (but not even started) and hiring border patrol agents(but who would want that job when their leaders sell them out any time the mexican drug gangs/government complain), then at least the problem is not getting worse. When you start talkiing about amnesty legislation, there will be a mad rush for the border to get in on it. It's not like the government has any way of proving who has been here or for how long.
    #10     May 20, 2007