Mini Dow Trading Begins Today

Discussion in 'Index Futures' started by tymjr, Oct 1, 2001.

  1. tymjr


    For those traders that have not heard:

    As of today, the mini Dow (YJ) is available through the CBOT/Eurex a/c/e platform. It is a very small contract. Initial Margin requirements are $1,080 per contract.

    Depending on commissions and liquidity, it may prove to be fertile ground to grow skills for new traders or an excellent introduction to index futures for undercapitalized vets. The relatively small value of each contract will allow any trader to limit losses to acceptable levels during the learning curve.

    Press release:,00.html


    Contract specifications:

    Info on all mini contracts on a/c/e such as Bond, Gold, or the proposed Soybean futures:,00.html

    This has been a public service announcement. :)
  2. DT-waw


    Average daily range of Dow futures will be around 80 - 100 pts , I guess. That is 160 to 200 dollars. If commissions at IB will be 2.95USD for 1 contract, new futures will be worse than ES futures.
    You must earn 3 pts just to cover commission costs.

    ES futures - daily range about 15 pts = 750 dollars, same commissions.

    I think in day trading it's very important to compare daily price range of financial instruments to commissions costs.

  3. tntneo

    tntneo Moderator

    DT-waw that's a good point of course.
    However, I would not mind scalp this new mini if there is enough volume. Also I did not compare the leverage but that is a very important factor for traders new to futures.

  4. Good point DT. Last year I was paper trading the NQ's using an intraday trend following approach and was consistently profitable. Just when I was ready to start trading, our (Canadian) regulators cut-off access to IB.

    Now that it looks like IB may be licensed in Canada I have been dusting it off and trying it again. Guess what, it is very marginal now and not worth trading. The reason is that commission and slippage (which is the other important factor) are much more significant with the index at 1200 than they were when it was at 4000. One glance at the index chart on an arithmetic scale shows why.
  5. WarEagle

    WarEagle Moderator

    Hey Guys,

    Anyone know which data providers will be carrying the new CBOT contracts? I'm using as a primary feed with Nextrend as a backup.

    I called and asked if they would carry them and their response was "What new CBOT contracts?" Why doesn't that surprise me? Anyway, the guy gave me the email of their data group ( ) to email and find out. Their response was that they didn't have plans to carry them now but might if enough people asked for them. I think that is absurd...if it trades, they should carry it. Anyway, anyone using qcharts or qfeed that wants these contracts should email them so they know there is some interest.

    I have not checked with Nextrend yet.

    Also, does anyone know what the exchange fee will be for these contracts? I had heard somewhere that the CBOT was going to do something similar for their A/C/E contracts that the CME did for the Globex mini's and either offer them free at first or for a smaller exchange fee (i.e. the $10 Globex fee we will soon be charged). The regular CBOT fee is $30/month.

    Any help is much appreciated.

  6. Atlantic


    hy Kirk!

    if you use globex e-mini data via livecharts ( - do you know when they will quit offer them for free? when will they start to charge the $10? on the website of i can't find anything about it.
  7. WarEagle

    WarEagle Moderator

    I am using Qcharts rather than LiveCharts, so there may be a difference, but my understanding was that the new exchange fee would start after September (that would be today), but I checked LiveCharts and they are still real-time.

    I think the new CME policy for globex quotes on subscription packages are free for the first 6 months and then $10/month thereafter, but I haven't heard anything from Qcharts that they will be charging me. I would think that once the CME enforces the fee, the free services like LiveCharts and Nextrend will no longer carry them real-time. At that point my guess is that you will need to subscribe to a regular package (like Qcharts) to get the mini quotes in real-time.

    But knowing how has handled other issues since Lycos took over, it will not surprise me if they are unable to change their fee structure simply because no one there seems to know how to program anything new into the system. :)

    I just hope someone can get it together enough over there to get these new CBOT contracts in the system. I would have changed quote vendors long ago, but I really like the interface and have gotten used to it. But I may have no choice.

  8. tymjr


    WarEagle: "Anyone know which data providers will be carrying the new CBOT contracts?"

    I'm running them now. I use CQG.

    DT-waw: "If commissions at IB will be 2.95USD for 1 contract, You must earn 3 pts just to cover commission costs."

    Yup, commissions and liquidity will be important factors to consider when deciding how or if one should trade them. We'll see how things shape up.
  9. I was going to ask if anybody knew what the symbol was on Livecharts but anyway they don't carry it yet, right? Anyway I was looking at the full contract the other day, 1 min chart, that's the one I use to trade NQ and there is little activity, no bars for 1 or 2 min, erratic action, no patterns etc so I am considering experimenting trading it off the cash which regularly shows patterns on all time frames and exhibits great trends, when the Dow starts moving, it usually keeps moving in the same direction for 15 min or more. What do you think ? Maybe I 'll watch the tape on A/C/E when LiveCharts or Nextrend provide it. BTW LiveCharts freezes constantly for the past couple of days. Do you have the same problem?
  10. Atlantic


    livecharts are running great today (with nq) - so far.
    #10     Oct 1, 2001