Mind circus

Discussion in 'Psychology' started by buccas13, May 4, 2012.

  1. buccas13


    Dear forum members,

    I’m facing a situation in my trading and I’m looking for a solution. I’m sure the experienced traders will be able to understand the problem well. I’ll be grateful if some of you can give me some ideas on how to work out on this one.

    Mind circus during live trading

    I have worked with two systems for three months paper trading. I’ve my set of rules and then few fine stuffs that act as clues when to stay out. In short, I’ve knowledge plus a little experience of the systems. What happens is when I sit for live trading my mind plays a circus and it makes me doubt the setup or outright reject the setup. I call this as a circus because it is well orchestrated and it happens every day.

    But then there also comes the add moment when I’m able to get out of the trap and get in the zone where I’m clearly seeing what is happening in the market. I want to be in a situation where by I can access that zone when I want and not at the mercy of my mind. I do have the feeling of how it is when I’m in the zone but it happens on very few occasions.

    In past one year, I’ve also worked on my overall thinking process to clear out a lot of biases and emotional clog that I had held for a longtime in my life. After having released a lot of negativity out of mind I’ve been able to look at the price movement and it has helped me find more opportunities and get the clues and also at times the intuitive feeling about the market. But it is taking long time to translate the same thing in the real time environment.

    I’m keen to work on myself so as to make trading effortless. I can understand the resistance I have inside and sometimes I can see myself clearly as two people inside me, One who knows about my system and method of trading and other who is creating doubt, anxiety and fear. I’ve developed this personal frustration as I can see that what I set out to do is out there but I’m not doing what I’m supposed to do.

    I hope I have been able to convey m problem. I’ll be thankful to anyone who can suggest me how to go about this inner change that I need to do.
  2. Hi Buccas,

    Are you profitable with your paper trading? For how long?

    A "little experience" as you say it is from my point of view not enough. You have to fully understand and deeply believe in your methods. Otherwise you cannot have confidence in your trading. And if you are not 100% confident you are prone to negative impacts from emotions.

    I am a firm believer that the psychology topic in trading is very much overrated. It just stems from the fact that most people have not enough understanding and experience, and hence, confidence in what they do. I've experienced it myself. I've made stupid things and blew several accounts until I got it. I have methods which work and in which I believe 100%. Since then, my emotions do not impact my trading in a negative manner any more. I don't say I don't have the emotions anymore, I sure have them. But they do not influence my decision making or execution.

    Also, you talk about clues and intuition about the market. Don't you have more or less exact rules or setups you are looking for? It is difficult to trade on gut feeling alone. I am sure some are good at it. But for most it is difficult to be profitable consistently by trading that way.

    Another aspect you should try out is to reduce your position size to the absolute minimum possible. And start to increase it only if it feels right for you.

    Hope this helps.


  3. I have to differentiate my statement above regarding psychology in order to be not misunderstood.

    What I've meant was that the problems caused by emotions in trading are "overrated" or misunderstood. They are overrated because it's not the emotions which cause the problems. It's the missing link between the traders personality and his or her method.

    So, in fact, the subject of psychology is still UNDERRATED in a sense that many traders have not yet been able to find a method which suits their personalities. Find a method that "fits" your personality. Or, even better, find a method which IS you!
  4. OP:
    Short and sour.

    You're experiencing an effort by your mind to allow you to survive.

    read about neuro science somewhere and get a basic understanding of how the mind steps in when a person is persistently putting himself in danger.

    You have acquired a post tramatic stress disorder.

    Search each of the four words in reverse chron.
  5. ocean5


    Subconsciously you are looking for attention.It comes from your childhood when you did wrong things to attract an attention from your mom,because,probably,she only gave you attention when you was fooling around.So you still want to fool around as you got older,to get attention.No need for the efforts,just don`t fool around.Praise yorself when you do it right.

    Don`t overleverage,don`t tell anything to anyone,don`t post on ET,don`t listen any advises - keep low key.Trend is your friend and other regular bla-bla whould suffice.
  6. Paddler


    Hi OP.

    Seriously face a mirror and ask yourself profoundly whether your "In the Zone" is a wishful stuff.

    Why don't you think of your emotional anxiety and fear originated from severe performance and logic leaks in your two trading systems?

    Do you really know ENOUGH and SCIENTIFICALLY how the market behave so that you can trade profitably?

    Apparently you are NOT! It is the root of your problem.
  7. i luv Jack's stuff.


  8. buccas13


    Dear forum members,
    I want to thank you all for giving your ideas and opinion about the whole situation. Ocean5 and Jack you guys nailed it right. They gave me ideas to work on myself. I’d posted this very problem on three forums and in one of them I was given an advice to try NLP. All the others gave me suggestion to work on my relationship with the system.

    To my situation working any further with my system (not having confidence on system and should work with it more) is watering the leaves. In past one year I had educated myself on topics of mind (how it works, how it behaves etc.). In few words, I can say I’ve been aware of problem but I’d not realized my problem. As I started to work with NLP I could very well find a link which has stopping from having a healthy relationship with anything that meant happiness and progress. In short all my actions have been in accordance of my belief system (the self-fulfilling prophecy thing.) At this point it feels I'm watering the roots now.

    When I was a kid I had asked a friend how is virus made. He said, “All the programs are made of if else conditions. So if you can modify even one condition of any software it qualifies to be a virus.” As you guys can understand it is for a layman to understand. I plan to work with the NLP solution for a while and to see my progress how it comes along. I hope that it is not just another Aha Aha moment for me.

    After having understood the techniques of NLP I’ve been able to understand how to go about visualization better. To tell you guys for those who follow these stuffs, the entire thing is changing the movie that is playing in your head for years.

    Some of the people are lucky to have least damaged belief system, a fairly good and healthy self-image. I want to congratulate those guys for being lucky. They do not know how it feels to be on the other side. Once again I want to thank you guys for the ideas and opinions. After 10 days I’ll get post my progress. I’m sure there are people out there who have the problem same as mine.

    I’ve downloaded two NLP programmes:
    The core transformation process by Connirae Andreas
    NLP for the 21st Century Dr. William Horton

    BTW: I think the analogy of clown is misfitting here. I'm more of the Elephant with learned helpessness.