Mental Ceilings and self fulfilling prophesies

OddTrader · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from bdixon619:

It is hard letting them go. Like was said, I am stuck. I went down almost $600 yesterday trying to change to a different time frame. I have to make the change I know. But like was said, I will have to continue to scalp until the new way of trading can support itself. Thank you for recognizing my achievement. I've never done 21 in a row before.

Many thanks.

Bruce.
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Thanks Bruce. Very well done!

For running the profits longer, I suppose you may need to do a few things, such as observing more charts real-time to understand the formation of (profits running) patterns.

Besides I guess you shouldn't change system without enough prior studies for the (causes and) effects that are based on your comprehensive understanding of your system. Possibly you can test the modified system with another instrument, while still making profits with the current one.

I would also think if you study very well your performance and the decision making process on that day, it would be not impossible that your high winning rate can be maintained at about the same level for very long time.

Good luck Bruce.

bubba7 · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from baggerlord:

I guess I should elaborate.

We have a picture of you. It's loud and clear. In the 40 plus years I have ben mentoring people you fit into the millionaire category. I will explain why to you over the next six months.

We got people like myself, new to trading and trying to make it.

You have been told that you are in a loop. You are in a loop. This is a precursor to the part about "trying to make it". You need to recognize for yourself that you are not beginning. What you are doing is starting another loop from 8.00/dollars an hour place and hopefully getting two jobs going.

You through 375 hours of work down the drain in one day as a way to show yourself you are not at the starting line yet to begin trading. In the next six months, on your terms, we at ET will get you off the ground. And you actually thought you stopped before your account went below the minimum. Most IB's would not let you continue to trade with them.

We got people that acually know how to trade, trade for a living, and make money.

You have to get it straight. There are people who ace the market and handle upwards of 90% on the money on the table. The money comes from a very wide assortments of people and goes to a fairly small group of people. If you are an average person you can think this through. Big outfits do not make big % gains per day or week or month. Why? They are too big. The biggest players in the financial industry, do not do very well simply because they are large. Guys like you provide money to others. They took, I was sidelined, 375x8 from you in a couple of events. There is no way these people are not stepping up to the line time after time during the day and taking money away from people in your present state. Your account would have been shut down on your next time out by your IB.

At the end of every day, a large % of the players have given a large amount of money to a small group of players who accept this large amount of money. In the middle between these players are abunch of people who diddle away their time on either side of break even.

Look at the small loser. He loses 1 point a day on the long term average. This is 7 hours work for you to lose in a day. You are smaller than that. It takes you a month of trading to lose (net) 1,000 dollars. Divided by 22 days this is less than a point a day. You fit into this category almost, then. Is this a big deal. No to you it isn't you do it with just one contract.

you think making 1 point a day in profits as a long term average is hot shit apparently. For 100 cars it is. I can tell you 100 ways come Sunday just how the rate of growth an account works under any mm or risk scenario there is. you do not know anything about this as yet because you are trading at killer high risk and you are jumping like the proverbial grasshopper so fast it is impossible for you to think about being intelligent. In 6 months we will have you straightened out on every screwed up point you are making intellectually every day. You make more erroneous intellectual points per day than you ever will in three years on the market.

Then we got the others. Everytime someone tries to post something intelligent they get overrun by 50 slobbering idiots claiming to avg 5 ES pts a day.

Let it go at this: the people who are making the money you, and all the others in the category that you have put yourself into, are giving them are not even here to say thank you to you.

These slobbering idiots who are taking your money, usually have colleagues that they circulate with and they chat about stuff that has not become part of your consciousness as yet. Where do you think they think up all this stuff you call bullshit that you are reading.

They aren't shy about this, but if you ask for some proof all of a sudden that is too personal, they don't like to show off etc... What a f***ing joke.

Well you need to see this stuff. Most people google for it or go to the manditory postings required by the NFA. Periodicals also carry this stuff as a matter of record to show the efficacy of their author lists. All firms under NFA recommend to prospects that they compare this information as part of the DD. I make sure that I comply with periodic reports to maintain my NFA 208 (E) part a status. No one in that loop is going to step out of line because of the consquences. Your asking them to is not within the realm of possibility by even what your standards will become once you get to thinking about it.

My guess is the majority of these morons are failed traders that can't whip up enough cash to open a new account, so they spend their time pretending they are traders and messing with people that actually do trade.

You whip up cash at 8.00 dollars an hour. The morons here who are recommending 5,000 per contract as a ratio, must be striving for failure as you say by not being able to whip up the cash for a new account. Most people here have had accounts for quite a while is my guess. Most people here are capable of monitoring the markets from before open to after close.

I was not trading Friday; I was in cash. When I am in cash I still follow the market though. You are still in the transition of getting the whatever to be able to monitor the market for whole days. So far you tell us you cannot hold a trade for 30 minutes because of your attention span.

Right now you are a failed trader. Right now your account is below minimum. Right now you cannot monitor fopr a whole day. right now you can whip up money at 8 bucks an hour and you have more money on the side you did not put in the market. Right now I am staying within the scope of what you lay on ET.

I for one am done with this BS, it is distracting me from my trading.

I am assuming that we are not going to see any more BS from you because you are stating that you are done with it and are now going to get to a place that is courteous and all the other Boy scout law elements (12) or B. Franklin virtues (13). Don't trade except on paper or simulator until you get your emotions under control. You should get it staight fairly soon that you can't prove anything to anyone in less than three years from now. You think people start out by blowing accounts. People that make it don't usually. The fast track to making money starts with knowing by instinctive reaction almost, how to exit a market that has been misjudged or simply doesn't do what you NEED it to do for you. You couldn't do 10 exits in a row if you tried. don't even think that you could do a flat (wash) exit any time one was required of you. You don't even know which way the market is going at any time at this point. Look at where you are.

There, I said my piece.

You haven't even started. You owe so many people apologies it isn't funny. You can shoot me; I'm the messenger today.
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OddTrader · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from bubba7:

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Scientist, I need your Decoder manual/software/whatever, please.

AngryBull · Aug 16, 2003

Obviously the discussion goes on that if you are a mastertrader if
you can take 1-2 Es-points per day.
I donÂ´t need to trade , my career as an entrepeneur
has been really successfull.
I donÂ´t need to work any more, I already have three homes
and 5 cars so I donÂ´t trade because I need to earn money.
But instead of playing golf 5 days a week I prefer to trade.
Just because for me it`s more fun, no more complicated
than that.
As an entrepreneur I started two different projects in two
different areas where the establishment laugth at me
and only waited for my bankruptcy, these two projects
become really big successes.
My opion is still if you not make 4-6 points per day
you are a medioker trader.
Why not publish your tradingsignals for one day as I did
so we can start study the differences between different
tradingsystems.

bubba7 · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from OddTrader:

Scientist, I need your Decoder manual/software/whatever, please.
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Get the technicolor one right off; don't fool around with the b/w one; it is obsolete.

Get an odd numbered one so it fits better.

OddTrader · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from AngryBull:

Obviously the discussion goes on that if you are a mastertrader if
you can take 1-2 Es-points per day.
I donÂ´t need to trade , my career as an entrepeneur
has been really successfull.
I donÂ´t need to work any more, I already have three homes
and 5 cars so I donÂ´t trade because I need to earn money.
But instead of playing golf 5 days a week I prefer to trade.
Just because for me it`s more fun, no more complicated
than that.
As an entrepreneur I started two different projects in two
different areas where the establishment laugth at me
and only waited for my bankruptcy, these two projects
become really big successes.
My opion is still if you not make 4-6 points per day
you are a medioker trader.
Why not publish your tradingsignals for one day as I did
so we can start study the differences between different
tradingsystems.
More...

It seems you would like to solely own the whole world, one day.

bubba7 · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from AngryBull:

Obviously the discussion goes on that if you are a mastertrader if
you can take 1-2 Es-points per day.
I donÂ´t need to trade , my career as an entrepeneur
has been really successfull.
I donÂ´t need to work any more, I already have three homes
and 5 cars so I donÂ´t trade because I need to earn money.
But instead of playing golf 5 days a week I prefer to trade.
Just because for me it`s more fun, no more complicated
than that.
As an entrepreneur I started two different projects in two
different areas where the establishment laugth at me
and only waited for my bankruptcy, these two projects
become really big successes.
My opion is still if you not make 4-6 points per day
you are a medioker trader.
Why not publish your tradingsignals for one day as I did
so we can start study the differences between different
tradingsystems.
More...

I am going to after Labor Day. I'm just finishing up some stuff for the jounal to begin. I am planning on going 6 months in real time.

candletrader · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from AngryBull:

Obviously the discussion goes on that if you are a mastertrader if
you can take 1-2 Es-points per day.
I donÂ´t need to trade , my career as an entrepeneur
has been really successfull.
I donÂ´t need to work any more, I already have three homes
and 5 cars so I donÂ´t trade because I need to earn money.
But instead of playing golf 5 days a week I prefer to trade.
Just because for me it`s more fun, no more complicated
than that.
As an entrepreneur I started two different projects in two
different areas where the establishment laugth at me
and only waited for my bankruptcy, these two projects
become really big successes.
My opion is still if you not make 4-6 points per day
you are a medioker trader.
Why not publish your tradingsignals for one day as I did
so we can start study the differences between different
tradingsystems.
More...

I see that AngryBull is still struggling with the notion of a long-run average, and still fails to recognize the annualized % implications of his proposed 4-6 points long run average (using any reasonable margining assumptions and even a crude money management scheme, 4-6pts per contract per day as a long run average will make AngryBull the next Bill Gates within a matter of years)... rather than making assertions, how about actually trading for a few years and then working out your long run average... I guarantee you that your views will be diametetrically opposed to what they are now...

4-6 points per contract per day as a long run average is not, as AngryBull puts it, better than a "medioker" trader... no sir, such a trader is one of the, if not the, best traders in the world...

AngryBull · Aug 16, 2003

Candletrader,
Why can you not publish your tradingsignals fot one day?

OddTrader · Aug 16, 2003

Quote from bdixon619:

I just did the calculation on my trades: $647.60/9 = $71.96 or 1.44 pts.

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I don't fully understand the above calculation/maths of 1.44 pts.

When using one contract (in and out) to gain 8 points within a day, I would evaluate it is 8 points on that day. I would call you an 8-poniter on that particular day. Why not?

I know I might be wrong. That's why I need to ask MarketSufer for more maths books.