Mathematics skills for discretionary trading.

Discussion in 'Trading' started by gotmessner, Mar 13, 2005.


  1. Market pace is most important in trading as the single unique factor that determines market risk. determing when and to what extent you are at risk is a cardinal function of trading. It turns out to be a sports memory type mind function. In other words you know this at all times immediately.

    Pace and risk are inverse functions when you are holding a postion.

    The first and primary factor that becomes clear to anyone who is able to think, is how beginners are required to operate as a consequence of their knowledge (lack of to be precise).

    A beginner may only be in the market at very restricted times as determined by derivatives. Beginners can't do derivatives so a substitute must be used.

    Notice how Proflogic quantifies pace indirectly by using deviation from norm (see line on chart below price) which is a derivative of price change indicatorso to speak.


    There is a common myth about paying dues to learn to trade. What is going on is beginners are in the market when the pace is to low for them (risk too high to be precise).

    Trading the market requires a great deal of mental activity and that activity has to be directed to what is important.

    I mention a type of trading, SCT, this means being in the market all the time and dealing accurately with NOW. NOW means "the present". The normal ROI on this style is high. compared to Proflogic which I rate at 1x (H-L), SCT runs at 3 x (H-L). Obviously the pace determines the extent of risk while pulling down profits continually.


    Knowing what is next sets up any beginner for doing low risk trades. Whether he trades is determined by measured risk. measured risk is easily observed with a calibrated indicator. All default setting for all indicators are in correct. This is because they were invented and defaulted before the advent of the PC. When the indicator signals, the beginer enters the trade at market (price is not important but minimum risk is excruciatingly important). He leaves when the risk increases and takes a profit. There never is a need for dues to be paid.
     
    #61     Mar 15, 2005
  2. Hi All,

    Jack referring to SCT, it may be of interest to the Mathematically schooled visiting this Mathematical thread, to reprint the central excerpt of the Seamless "Continuous Trading (SCT) Report":

    " The fractal change is based upon statistics that predicate that any loop filibration on one fractal can be terminated on the next faster fractal using the same rules. This is an abstract statistical method based on Alexander’s Method for least connecting systems for optimum system operation. A concurrent theorem on the migration of the market operating point and what the controlling facet is, is what establishes the market as a system of interrelated cells and how that connectedness may be optimized. One of the dimensions of the operating point matrix is the set of fractals. "

    Hope this helps,
    nononsense
     
    #62     Mar 15, 2005
  3. HectorG

    HectorG

    Pomposity is usually a sign of defeat.

    It's amazing how some losers try so hard to sound smarter than they really are.

    They sound like they are quite lonely and have no friends, too.


     
    #63     Mar 15, 2005


  4. Anyone can do anything they want. In your case, you can do anything you want. Asking me is funny. Give yourself a gold star for your AGM.

    When you begin a rational process, for your personal benefit, you will find that the "either/or" function has limited application. As you apply it now and here, it is less than useful, were someone other than you thinking along the lines you express.

    I do not in ET express optimum methods. I simply build upon what is on the table.

    My comments elsewhere in this thread are in support of a person who is beginning and who has an open mind.

    He is simply easing down the road and noticing some things that are worth using going toward building mind traces. By repeated consideration of more and more congruent elements he will build a reinforcing knowledge base and then move towards developing skills by repeated use and reinforcement.

    This is iterative refinement in contrast to dumping something and picking up something else to replace it. You may find someday that it is difficult to dump incorrect knowledge. As the mind works, immediately replacing something has never happened. The subjunctive conflict of the old and new will be biting you for quite a while if you carry out your stated plan, as silly as the statement sounds to most all of us.
     
    #64     Mar 15, 2005
  5. Jack,

    You are slightly off topic. This is a thread about Mathematics, No?

    nononsense
     
    #65     Mar 15, 2005
  6. Anseld

    Anseld

    some people here obviously take themselves and the quality of their knowledge too seriously.

    amusing.
     
    #66     Mar 15, 2005
  7. If you make up the chart and name the posibilites the decimal equivalent of the binary number, then you see the listing has some good characterisitcs. Its symmetry is the most outstanding.

    For making money it is powerful to see that reversals in the cycle happen when all three variable values change simultaneously. It is also noteworthy that at the maximum rate of change of price (crossing the cycle axis and farthest from the extremes) is when two of the three variables change. The least change (one variable only) occurs at all four other divisions of the cycle.

    When a person comes up with a construct to describe something, it is nice to have such elegance show up.

    Thanks for posting the graphic associated with this. It makes a nice answer sheet.

    The quote from SCT which always appears without fail at some point is designed to point out to all of you that often what I suggest is not easy to understand. Its nothing for anyone to worry about.

    Think about it this way. A while back I did a trade of 100,000 shares. Av cost 11. Av sell 28. It was actually 31 exit trades and 20 entry trades. 11 accounts. The SEC didn't bat an eye by then. Before, in the years preceeding I often had SEC citations for "insider" trading. I consider it a compliment that I was cited and then the citation was withdrawn. They would not allow me to have any software related to their monitoring. This paragraph about an exit in one day of my life is easy to understand. mathematically it requires one subtraction and moving the decimal point 5 places. Enjoy.
     
    #67     Mar 15, 2005
  8. You are most welcome, sir. Glad to be of service.

    - Spydertrader
     
    #68     Mar 15, 2005
  9. Kewl... OK. The binary sequencing is simple enough. In class at the undergrad level, we did synchronous programming which can be translated right onto PLA's (programmable logic arrays) if I remember correctly. Asynchronous stuff is where we throw out the clock for efficiency (my girlfriend aced that class). ALSO KEWL but OT! Ok so Price, Volume, Acc/Dist. Price action is a result of Volume action, Volume action a result of Acc/Dist. The last appears somewhat tricky but I watch for it on the T&S (should do it on Level 2 but institutions effectively color the tiers beyond what I can percieve as decipherable A/D shifting). So 3 binary variables with 2 possibilities (2^3 = 8 unique states). The combinatorics of which can be the following 8 States (computational science treatment - ie state machines). I use xor instead inclusive or to make clear that the states do not overlap.

    Price Up AND Volume Up AND Accumulation
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Up AND Distribution
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Down AND Accumulation
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Down AND Distribution
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Up AND Accumulation
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Up AND Distribution
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Down AND Accumulation
    XOR
    Price Up AND Volume Down AND Distribution

    So the nodes are the above and the progression across the nodes is controlled by the underlying variable shifts (a/d for volume, volume for price).

    Do you mean integration in the mathematical sense? The sum of buying and selling (acc/dist)?


    OK, I get this two and actually do watch for this on T&S. The immediate participant wants to exit his position and the buyer wants to enter the position. Both have opposing beliefs of the future state of the price action, thus they trade only as a single consequence of agreeing upon the current price.


    Forgive me for being wordy. I touch type as fast as I think so it's difficult to realize when I haven't written too much. The reasoning is logical. More buyers then sellers and vice versa (supply and demand at work). Fewer suppliers/sellers, buyers will increase their bid price to the ask for the desired supplies. Fewer buyers, suppliers/sellers decrease their ask price to the bid to offload their supply.

    You mention a chart of four columns, but I only see 8 states. The combinations I presume are 3 variables each with 2 states (2^3) and hence 8 permuations of 3 variables with 2 states.


    The chart is attached below. I had to think hard about how to treat phases and it was somewhat tricky to get the sequencing right. I've attached with full annotations. A 1 implies an increase in the value of the variable, a 0 denotes a decrease in the value of the variable. I adjusted the amplitude only for appearance reasons. I had to carefully think about this to make the binary and sine curves and their phases gel. When I adjusted the phases, it brought up a serious question, do these variables get treated independently and if so, then the curves themselves will continually move in and out of phase with respect to each other. As a consequence, a single state may be so brief that it passes by unobserved. Is this true?

    I just saw your other posts. You are quicker than I on these forums and I thought I was monitoring continually.
     
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    #69     Mar 15, 2005
  10. I looked at your list and it is not correct. I guess it is difficult to get the idea of a cycle straight.

    The graphic posted is a good example of what I meant to convey.

    You can see here that the detractors are giving a fairlyconsistent view of where they are coming from also. I'm a bad guy it turns out for them.

    I attached the table of the combinations and permutations of three variables. Each variable stands alone and can be looked at a a measure of something. you are stating a lot of things that you have thought up and that is fine. It jst goes to show how when two people look at something they see different things happening.

    At this point it is being suggested that this thread is about mathematics and I am off topic. Naturally the trading cycle and characterising it with binary values is not math to that person. that is how some minds work as well.

    Check out the list and see if it means anything to you about combinations and permutaions.

    I gave a 1 to increasing and A and a 0 to decreasing and D.

    This is a description of the dynamic of the market possible conditions at any given time. What is not included are the times when no money is being made.


     
    #70     Mar 15, 2005