maybe this could result in excellent businees opportunities for us as well. i think what we would see is an alternate display facility setup in the caymens with nyse nasd whatever exchange allowing direct access through this. since the adf would have business on site for clearing the trades these trades would not be technically taking place in the united states. you would still be responsible for income tax as a trader as long as you remain a citizen. since the business is conducted offshore this tax would have no bearing. nyse and nasd wouldnt oppose this and why should they, they dont want to see the drop in volume, thats money out of their pockets as well. what is the us gonna do ban exchanges next. we are still a capitalist country and i hope we remain that way. or if the govt really had some balls why stop at taxing trades just make the markets illegal to participate in, lets really stir things up. find those ways around the bullshit, hell im doing that right now with my 5dimes sports betting account. placing bets in the us is illegal but if the business is setup outside the country all seems to be right with the world.
Of course I'm smart enough to understand your point and it's a decent one. I'm not sure if valuations would change if 100 people priced a security or if a million people weigh in. A sample's a sample. Certainly traders don't provide anything more than opportunity liquidity-no one on ET helped soften the slide in CDO's-and yes there are wasted great minds who'd provide society greater utility on a Taco Truck than getting their ass kicked trading in their underwear while surfing porn sites. But it's not the duty of Big Brother to force those decisions upon a discriminated class. Much like asset targeting-another failed moral endeavor-transactions taxes seek to force decision making based on an artificial, arbitrarily imposed variable. These taxes, r are the anti-thesis of free thought-I have a similar problem with the mortgage interest deduction. The market itself will weed out participants, strategies and sacred cows. That IS AFTER ALL why markets exist. The left better be careful. People like me are rapidly concluding that defending our will by violent expression is no less immoral than attacks upon liberty via Democratically elected institutions. Tyranny is responded to by anharchy.....
Here's my comment on his blog...what an idiot. Mark how can you possibly think that this idea wouldnât affect liquidity? The daytrading community that I have been a part of for 10+ years provides 25%+ of the daily volume on each major exchange. We provide liquidity and tighten spreads. There is no arguing that fact. An average daytrader trades about 100k shares per day (myself around 200k). If I understand your idea you would tax me .1*200,000=$20,000 per day. Myself and every trader I know would be instantly out of business, and this includes the black box traders. This includes hedge funds, pension funds, professional traders, mutual fundsâ¦everybody would be taxed to death overnight. I donât understand how you see another side to this. Donât think because I am a trader that I donât support some type of transaction tax. Somebody does have to pay back the billions that have been used to slow the death of our financial system. As someone stated earlier, every stock sale has a minimal fee from the SEC. It costs me around $300/mo which I believe is a fair cost to doing business. Itâs based on a % of dollar value of the transaction, and it works. Why try to reinvent the wheel? You are putting the entire system at risk with this type of idea. Every trader, every hedge fund, mutual fund, brokerage, and pension fund would see a huge increase in cost of doing businessâ¦and that would be passed on the the retail public. Our beautifully efficient markets that are admired the world over would come to a screeching halt. Re-do your mathâ¦your premise is wrong.
Only an idiot like Cuban would let a player in his prime walk away who would become the league's MVP because he balked at his salary, and then give away the ranch in trade for a player who makes considerably more than MVP Nash and a player who is definitely past his prime. Cuban may argue that the Mavericks make money, but had he kept Nash there is REAL reason to believe this bonehead would be wearing a couple of world championship rings. As it is, he is a world champion a-hole, but the only rings he possesses are those left around his bathtub. If he had LESS opinions on every subject that does NOT concern him, he might have been able to form a reasonable opinion that paying Steve Nash in his prime may have been a better option than overpaying Jason Kidd in his twilight.
Let these fucking idiots do what they do.... Here's what can...and will happen...that is of course the US will not allow any money to be invested by foreigners and create jobs in the US....which really would not be shocking either.... The listings and the exchanges can just domicile in another country that wants the tax base and the securities business.... All it takes is a super sized BATS which has already proven that a small Kansas City company can set up computer banks wherever it pleases and take significant market share from the almighty NYSE and Nasdaq....in just a few months.... Not to mention the millions of further job losses that would result because of this action..... If you look at the new ipo count entries...this is already happening anyway.... The securites business just needs the internet and a few computer banks......however in this case the domicile of many of the remaining US companies would become non US companies....and you can bet other countries cannot wait for this money to arrive.... Check mate....you fucking moron.... Quite frankly...the already super sized legal largesse already created by fucking legal morons has already created capital flight.....This would just be one more nail in the US coffin.... Quite frankly....it would be a lot more efficient to blacklist the US as a place to do listed exchange business because of the finicky legal bullshit that spins on the whims of legal largesse buffoons..... Computer banks can run fast and efficient in many other countries that would promote a far easier and more cost efficient business....in almost every facet of the business..... Corporate profits can be domiciled elsewhere....fast as a jet can land....pal....ink and paper cut both ways..... And more efficient money making speaks....to your ex-tax base...... The big ex brokers are already placing bets outside the box.... When is the US going to wake up and get rid of these fucking morons....?????? Has the US not lost enough already ???????
mark cuban also said youtube was doomed to failure right before google bought it for billions. they will probably pass some stupid 'tax' like this and exempt the banks... they will give them some market maker exemption. so the people that caused all the problems will benefit once again and you suckers will pick up the bag. Not one of you will do a thing about it.
i guess it's mostly scalpers weighing in here with all the animosity. personally i agree with MC and was saying the same thing recently. a flat transaction fee applied across the market (to all participants - no exceptions) would reduce high frequency trading and probably noticeably improve mid frequency trends. the markets might resemble investment flow a lot more, and scalping/bot noise a lot less. does high freq trading add valuable real liquidity? doesn't seem clear cut to me at all. i always personally did better in less saturated markets and would love to see a premium attached to high frequency trading
If they did pass a transaction tax, I wonder what the tax would be for S&P futures, full size or emini? If it was only 20 cents a contract that would be no problem, but I wonder if it would be more than that?
good question. seems like the higher the transaction fee, the longer the avg hold frequency would increase. i'm hard pressed to imagine this actually happening, especially without exceptions given to certain segments of the market that would basically kill the value to me personally... then as another poster mentioned, there's the issue of volume potentially moving offshore or to wherever the rule doesn't exist. who knows though, getting rid of noise might attract other forms of more committed liquidity/volume in place of the displaced high freq volume