Marines killed Iraqis ‘in cold blood’

Discussion in 'Politics' started by james_bond_3rd, May 18, 2006.

  1. The lens sees the truth.

    What you are suggesting is that there is a reasonable and justifiable explanation for what the lens sees.

    Look, we are supposed to be the good guys.....

     
    #61     May 24, 2006
  2. g222

    g222

    Yes, the lens does see the truth - the truth of a moment frozen in time. But it doesn't see the mitigating circumstances - if any - leading up to that moment.

    I'm not suggesting that there is a reasonable and justifiable explanation for what the lens sees, but rather that there may be mitigating circumstances involved. Maybe not. But let's give the benefit of the doubt.

    The loss of Allied lives due to friendly fire and those acts already proven to have been commited by US soldiers represent a number of isolated incidents. I don't believe that they make us the bad guys.
     
    #62     May 24, 2006
  3. What doubt?

    There are accusations.

    Now let the courts decide, or whitewash, as the military is so prone to do....

    We are dependent on the military, yet they have a history of lies and propaganda.

    Or do we forget the fiascos with Pat Tillman and Jessica Lynch?

     
    #63     May 24, 2006
  4. g222

    g222


    Agreed on all counts.
     
    #64     May 24, 2006
  5. Curious. There are in excess of 100,000 troops in the theatre. Would you let the actions of say 50, color your opinion of the whole? If so, how can I ever NOT claim white folks to be supportive of slavery? How can the white race not be completely labeled for its bad acts throughout history? The democratic party opposed the civil rights legislation. Should we not look at all democrats as wanting all minorities to be disadvantaged based on that original position?

    I don't think the blanket of US (not United States but "us") as good or bad guys is appropriate. I think the term is/was "only" for analogies. But we need to come away from easy explanations and start to look into the deeper complexities that make the fight necessary. There are losers in war on both sides. The war does not become unjust. The war does not shine a beacon of excellence either. War really is hell, and it ain't nice.

    It's expensive in life, capital, opinions, and love. We really do need to appreciate the freedom that war "CAN" bring. And we should pray its quick, and complete, fade into the history that details human growth. :)
     
    #65     May 24, 2006
  6. Here is the problem though.

    It may be only a few, but does the upper level management ever take any responsibility?

    They act as it never happens, as if they never gave the orders....which we all know is BS...

    The right wing spins this of course, as they have done ever since Kerry pointed out what was happening in Vietnam. Kerry wasn't blaming those who were just following orders, he was blaming the politicians and the generals.

    When do we ever see the generals saying it was their fault, or the politicians?

    We all know war is an ugly business, and in the heat of battle men do things that they wouldn't do normally, but it is the power behind all of this which give the US a bad name, they hide in shadows and are as corrupt as hell.

     
    #66     May 24, 2006
  7. Apparently three commanders were relieved of duty. In the military that is the equivalent of having your career terminated.
     
    #67     May 24, 2006
  8. There are only a few racists too! Do you ever take responsibility? Can I blame you for the ills? Of course I can! Can I say you sanction bad behavior? Yes, I can. But that does not make me right.

    You act as though you (personally) know that the orders came from the very top. Not just high up, but the very top. We all know that is BS...

    The left spins this of course, as they have done ever since the press pointed out that Clinton could have avoided all this before Monica became an issue. Clinton wasn't blaming the press, he was blaming republicans for meddling in his personal life.

    When do we ever see any politician saying that any poor legislation was their fault, or the military?

    We all know politics is about power, and in the face of losing any many of them will do just about anything. And rather than admit their short they would cower in the shadows claiming political privilege immunity.

    As you see, the argument can be played correctly from either side. The question is, when are we the people going to stand together to get the complete story without their intervention and sway. And more importantly, understand that it is ultimately our responsibility for their laxity! :)
     
    #68     May 24, 2006
  9. Uhhh, I don't give orders to racists.

    Doh!

    The buck stops where?

    At the buck private, of course....sure it does.

    Sorry mate, but your argument is full of shit....

     
    #69     May 24, 2006
  10. No more shit than you. You can give out orders. Whether or not they have any impact can be your only stance here. The buck never was anywhere to stop. Again, cliche and anecdotal responses on your part. I've learned this about you.

    The final responsibility can be that of anyone who wishes to take responsibility which we all go lacking in in many instances. We tend to party represent and then claim lack of personal ability to make a difference. When one on the left screws up there is soft handed justice just as when the right must punish its own.

    There is very little difference in either side and its time that you start to realize this. Most of these Bozo's (sorry Bozo) have limited ability to execute their positions. They just happened to be the winner in a race containing a piss poor field of candidates. Competence was not a requirement for the job. None of us elected them to fill the positions on the various committees. When they were elected, that was not a criterion for review. Why are we acting surprised when we have such lame policies, legislation, and results?

    Oh, and it ain't party dependent either! :)

     
    #70     May 24, 2006