I was just trying to keep history from being polluted. I am not saying that it is the greatest thing in the world. I am just concerned that I have watched and effort to systematcially break down truth accross every discipline. When it can so easily be corrected it shuld be. Truth is I have a difficult time discerning what is true and I do not need to have history erased.
This is pretty much where I go with it (admittedly for far different reasons - most of the religiuous ones don't wash with me). When I threw my sandwich in the garbage that day I wasn't about to rationalize which meat was "acceptable." I knew if I were quitting then this meant halting the injestion on all animal flesh. I never regretted the decision. One of the unexpected benefits of this has been that animals like me more. Chalk it up to anything you want from pheromones to telepathy, but they know I don't eat them and they like it. Since the meatless diet I've had an 8-point buck walk up to me in the woods and eat a cookie out of my hand, raccoons come right up and sit at my feet, and birds fly around within a foot of my head. For whatever reason, they just know. One thing I've pondered yet never had to address firsthand, is what do veg parents do when their kids want meat? Back east I had a friend whose kids imposed this scenario. His policy was, "If you go buy a burger that's up to you, but don't bring it in the house." They'd show up at his biz-partner's place and beg hot dogs and stuff . Since I don't have any kids I've often wondered what I'd do in the same situation. Hopefully I'd be just as cool about it. There are too many people with their asses over the fence (as Granny would put it) about the whole thing as it is.
...Let me guess, you were singing Zippidty Doo Da while cartoon animals flew around you???? LOL!!!....You better go eat some meat buddy because it sounds like your missing some amino's up there....
jem. I thought swapping quotes would lead to slow and painful conclusion whereas interrogating the Declaration of which you must surely admit contains the ACTUAL WORDS and therefore is a good indication for any context being considered, might lead to more obvious clarity. It appears I wrongly assumed you were attempting to make a serious point. Your reference to Jeffersonâs second Inaugural speech is laughable. You talk of CONTEXT, just how do you expect arrive at any reasonable context if you take the beginning of one paragraph of this speech, select the word you like, then chop 300 words out in one place to shift the context of the word Creator off subject into another paragraph which you conveniently delete 900 words away from and finish by constructing one paragraph of your own, wrongly connecting Creator to God of Israel, with the exuberant conclusion " I rest my case. I am thoroughly excited by my overwhelming and convincing victory " lol. That would be hilarious if it wasn't so ridiculous. The Second Inaugural Address you refer to was a political address, Jefferson was a political animal. That he played to the peanut gallery with "God of Israel" is not a surprise. That he and all the other Founding Fathers left out specific religious reference in the Declaration IS a surprise IF he believed in a "God of Israel". This is an emotive contextual narrative especially to a bunch of bible thumping persecuted new land religionists. The way in which the Declaration of Independence specifically leaves out reference to a "God of Israel" in which he professes to, is strikingly evident. Here are some other quotes for you by the same Thomas Jefferson, in his writings to other Founding Fathers friends and colloquies, painting a different picture and one which gives some CONTEXT as to why a "God of Israel" was not deemed fit for inclusion in the Declaration itself..... "To talk of immaterial existences is to talk of nothings. To say that the human soul, angels, god, are immaterial, is to say they are nothings, or that there is no god, no angels, no soul. I cannot reason otherwise ... without plunging into the fathomless abyss of dreams and phantasms. I am satisfied, and sufficiently occupied with the things which are, without tormenting or troubling myself about those which may indeed be, but of which I have no evidence." "I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular superstition one redeeming feature. They are all alike, founded upon fables and mythologies." "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." Your wasting your time just attempting to wrap religion around anything and everything even to the point of making up your own context by recreating history so as to fit a god in every corner of it.
Stu if you go back and look at this discussion we had, I said the U.S. was founded on a Judeo Christian principles. You stated hey you are wrong and you pretty muched guaranteed Creator with big C since was really nature per some fantasized Deist argument. I said I doubt that it was the case-- we had a couple of potential deists but that the large majority fo the founders were christians. Patrick Henry laid it for you. Jefferson said the bedrock of this country is the bible and I gave you context for Being with a big B being the God of Israel in Jeffesons inaugural address. I stated that normally Creator with a big C would mean God and then I showed you that it is consistent with Jefferson's use in his other important writings (speech) I will bet that that was consistent with everyone's use in the day also. The deist argument is contrived and after viewing Jefferson's inaugural address it is rendered bogus. Go back and look what you said early on in this thread and then view that in light of the second address it does not fly. Finally and most importantly the above is sort of an argument about whether the declaration was Protestant or not. That is not how this discussion started. I stated that the U.S. was founded on Judeo Christian principles you denied it. Stu even if you were right with the deist stuff ----that does nothing to change the fact that this countries freedoms stem from the Judeo Christian line of thought. Respect for individuals and the freedom of speech, government, religion among others is the hallmark of our nation and Judeo Christian principles. Why cant you admit that----- are you saying that america used a system pinned to seventh century arabia or eastern teachings. whats up just say Christian foundation. So what if you do not like it, it is history. P.S. I just reread your posts. It is logically inconsistent to say hey jefferson played to the peanut gallery so he used the God of Isreal in one speech (where he used Creator and talked about Being being the God of Isreal) but when he was writing the Declaration and having to kowtow to all the other signers he meant Creator equals the deist view. Did you have Jefferson's private thoughts as he was writing. Also who cares what he meant according to Jefferson, it is how it was taken by all the Christians at the time, the peanut galleray and the christian founders. And while Creator was some words away, being and god of isreal and the analogy of Gods people being led to the promised land and lead to america is very powerful and can leave no doubt who the Creator was.