Manipulator defined?

harrytrader · Feb 17, 2003

The nobel prize Maurice Allais affirms that thanks to real time Market can be manipulated technically very easily - more easily than if it was just a fixing once a day (he doesn't say that it is he says that it CAN but when interests are so huge ....): but you don't have to get a nobel prize to understand why: just look how supermarkets control the flow of clients they divide them between as many cash registers as needed. Real time can be a technical mean of division. And as I said in another post, my model equations show that volume has no impact on key price levels which make the traders react - of course volume are significant statistically for judging the market but this is not I am talking about.

I Missed Boat · Feb 17, 2003

Quote from MondoTrader:

hey Larry, "read reminiscences of a stock operator", its a classic.

Sometimes when a market seems screwy it is because it is reflecting the buying or selling of the biggest player in that market on a given day. Sometimes that is intentional, especially around options expiration for large caps, and far more often for thinly traded small caps.
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Well thank goodness we're talking about something relevant. I mean, while some things have stayed the same (corporate deception, the attitudes of traders), some things have changed (the power of a few players to manipulate the market). As someone noted before, perhaps a few players can move thinner stocks, options, etc in the direction they want, but it can't stay there long unless it belongs there!

thetraderprofit · Feb 17, 2003

Only 5 posts, but all of them brilliant.

I couldn't have said it better.

larrylivingston · Feb 17, 2003

thanx traderprofit...i just cant believe the flaws in some of these traders psychology...dont worry about so called manipulators worry about where there is opportunity!

SethArb · Feb 18, 2003

or was there some low volume manipulation
into the close today ...

alot of names ramped up in the last 30 -45 minutes

qdz2 · Feb 21, 2003

you are not alone. we love and hate manipulation.

qdz2 · Feb 21, 2003

In my book,

ORDER MANIPULATORS = PRICE MOVERS
PERIOD.

tfmoney · Feb 21, 2003

hehhe

omcate · Feb 28, 2003

Quote from qdz2:

How do you define manipulator? Do you think there is surely a different kind of participants in the markets different from many of us, whom I call them manipulators. Their goal is different from traders or investors who follows the market. They move the market the way they intended. Most of these manipulators don't care about close open positions on daily basis. They have longer term outlook. For example, if you and I ride the move today and want to close or even the positions at close before a long weekend, how do you explain there was no pull-back due to increasing supply? Depends on the liquidity, the manipulators control today's close more or less as planned. Note, stock manipulators usually come out after the bond market closes at 3pm EST or when the liquidity/volume are low. There is usually less resistance, perhaps due to lack of some arbitrators, and easier to control. Of course, their are as many as a score types of manipulators in the market. They have different habits, time frame, and activity patterns. Let's define them and put them on the watch list.

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The following news is related to market manipulation:

Reuters
Japan Punishes JP Morgan Unit
Friday February 28, 4:59 am ET

TOKYO (Reuters) - Japan's financial regulator said on Friday it had ordered the brokerage unit of J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. (NYSE:JPM - News) in Tokyo to suspend stock trading on its own account for 10 business days from March 3-14.

The penalty against the Tokyo office of J.P. Morgan Securities Asia Pte Ltd. was issued three days after a watchdog said the unit had manipulated market prices through irregular transactions involving exchangeable bonds (EBs).

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/030228/financial_japan_jpmorgan_6.html

iceman1 · Feb 28, 2003

Quote from larrylivingston:

this is to qdz2... you use the word hope...you say you get in and "HOPE" the market or manipulators move the market for you...your terminology is scarey...there is absolutely no place for "hope" in a professional trading business...your problem is not manipulators it is your own market psychology...change the psychology i beg you...your playing a suckers game and although i make my money off of many of such sucker ill make an exception here...if you cant spot the sucker buddy...you are the sucker
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bro gdz2... just doesn't get it. But we need guys like him in the makerts... someone's got to feed the pot.

But in my opinion... gdz has a maturity problem. And as I've posted before you can't trade successfully if your maturity quotient is too low. Maturity as in being able to take responsiblity for your defeats as much as your successes.