You have no idea who read your post, only who responded. You think your post is clear because you wrote it, but you failed to include details, such as how much experience you have, and other relevant information that would have made your post more understandable. In other words, you lack communication skills and people aren't going to read the entire thread for clarity. Unless you are willing to pay a mentor, no expert would want to take you to the next level. People who could help you don't want to be bothered, and if anybody does offer to work with you it will probably end up in a cluster. Being a trader is about being independent, not looking for security blankets. Take one of those $30K courses so you will have the confidence you need to be successful.
I apologize. The moderator was approving some and delaying others and I guess nothing showed up on your end. I saw you posting replies to others after mine and basically took that as a "fuck you". My mistake, so let's please start over. I was also going to leave this forum (it's filled with toxicity and nonsense here) but will be finishing this discussion before leaving so I can try to help you out. Let's be blunt. How much do you have in Apex? A few 10s of thousands? Few hundreds of thousands? How long have you been with them, how many months, and how close are you to the 4 month window to withdraw everything? The company and the owner (Darrell Martin) gives off very creepy and predatory vibes. Go read their reviews on TrustPilot. Here's the link for your convenience: https://www.trustpilot.com/review/apextraderfunding.com?stars=1 They try to shut anyone down that disagrees with their opinion or calls them out on anything. They threaten legal action against customers who post negative reviews. They are trying to limit the damage to their reputation because they attract gamblers with their low cost evals and resets, and I'm beginning to think they are having cash flow problems. The reason they delay payouts for 4 months is because they are hoping you blow-up in the mean time and then they won't have to pay you. Most will blowup during that timeframe because most of their clientele cannot trade. If they cap payouts at $2k/payout then they can limit their risk and figure out how much of a monthly burn they have in regards to paying out from the bucket shop (it is a bucket shop). They can also close your account and not pay you out for any reason they see fit! Read the fine print. This shady business practice isn't worth you time. I would highly suggest once you hit the 4 month window to withdraw EVERYTHING before it's too late, and go somewhere else. In the meantime, I would highly recommend TopStep. I am not affiliated with them in any way (I did a combine but I need to trade real money - SIM isn't my thing, but I really liked their setup and how they treated customers. The whole thing just felt well put-together). In 2 days you can qualify for a funded account. In 5 you can get your first payout, and receive weekly payouts for up to 50% of the balance for the first 30 days. After 30 days you can take everything out and close the account if you wish. This is 2x-3x faster than Apex to get all of your money (20 trading days a month * 4 months = 80 days... 80 / 30... etc.). Trade both if you can. Build an account/equity with TopStep so you don't have poor cash flow prior to switching. As for other traders... What are you looking to gain out of it? More experience/knowledge? Refine your edge? Are you just looking for capital? If you're THAT good then contact someone at Optiver, SIG, or somewhere and show them your trade history. Make waves. If you can swing bank and they can see that then you might have a shot. I'd guess you'd have more of a chance doing something like that than trying to find some lone ranger on a forum that might throw cash at you. What size are you trading? If you start maxing out your margin and swinging 50 lots you're broker is most likely going to call you. Ask him if he can set you up with other successful clients/firms. You gotta trade real money for this, obviously, and get out of funding combines for this to happen. Also, let's be realistic. If you're hot shit and have a bunch of money in Apex, and you have real edge, then what's stopping you from trading your own funds and scaling up without the ridiculous funding company requirements? You could start trading a 5 lot and making some decent coin tomorrow.
I'm not trying to start shit with you (we haven't even met yet) but you really need to cut that "%%" shit out at the beginning of every post and putting in random emotes. Very hard to read your material because it's unedited and annoying to read. You need to figure out if you're playing in a sandbox or if you're here to be clear, direct, understood, and overall, to make money. My 2c and not trying to be a dick. Just keeping it real.
What exactly does this mean? Are you saying that you can read the market and are looking for someone else to bounce ideas off of, or are you saying that you cannot read the market and want to get better? I don't know what level you're at but here's something to consider: Price Action is mostly bullshit. This term gets thrown around a lot and most people don't even understand what it means. Everyone talks about it because that's all anyone talks about (the noobs, anyway). Here is my definition of Price Action: "how price moves through time and the slightly recognizable patterns it creates while doing so". Simple. Price Action will allow you to get in at better prices but ONLY if it occurs within specific timeframes and near specific levels on the chart. It DOES NOT give you direction or market sentiment. You CANNOT let a chart pattern tell you where the market is going next. It is simply a mechanism for entering at a better price in the context of a move you want to be in on based on other analysis. One could even argue that Price Action doesn't even matter, and all you really need to do is see if price is reacting around a level enough to potentially stall it, so that you can fade it in the other direction, and entering at the lowest (if long) or highest (if short) price possible. Consolidation pattern, flags, triangles... all that shit is really just the same thing: buyers/sellers in a tight range. Once you "get" trading there's really nothing to talk about. You say that you "believe" you have edge. What does this mean? How long have you been trading? How long have you been consistently profitable? Either you have edge or you don't. Are you just now putting up numbers or have you been at this for months/years and consistently pulling in some decent cash? If you're trading some moving average crossover/MACD bullshit then eventually that will fail. How exactly do you trade? I mean most successful guys I know are either on a sell side/buy side desk at a bank or on some beach somewhere swinging 100 lots on ES and just living life. The guys not tied to a desk trade a few hours a day where the volatility/volume is (US open) and then call it quits. The trading "community" largely consists of idiots who think their backtested stochastic system is as good as the Yale graduate working at Goldman, who can stop the market with his 5000 lot order, or the guy that worked a desk for years who has years of experience and is now trading his own funds. To everyone who is actually putting up numbers: it's just a job. I assume you're up and coming and did this on your own? What exactly are you looking for in watching someone trade live? You're right, most can't (aka retail traders), but the ones that can are usually working together so it's not like they're visiting forums and trying to get together for a cookout or some shit. They'll see each other tomorrow morning. You need to be more specific on what you want and why you want it and I will try my best to help you. Personally I don't even live in the USA anymore (fuck that place) but maybe a meet up is possible if I can further understand what it is that you're looking for? If you're lonely and looking to get into the trading world then I would suggest you fight to get into some type of firm and then you can leave this internet bullshit behind and all the morons that will poison you eagerly if you let them.
Ok, I apologize as well for my last post. I appreciate you being objective and using logical reasoning skills. This isn't to disparage anyone else here, really have no interest in being rude to others, debating or having them be rude to me. At the same time I get the feeling a lot of these replies are not in good faith or the people giving them don't actually understand what it takes to be profitable in day trading. Can't necessarily prove that though, so it is possible my assumption is incorrect. Anyways this is where I may actually be guilty of failing to communicate clearly, but I will do my best to answer your questions since I really appreciate your post. It's a pretty simple understanding to myself personally, but people are saying I am not giving enough information. I am just going to put it all out there. Apologize if it's lengthy or difficult to read. (1) Exactly what I want is someone to come trade with me and observe the process, so they can get on the same page, see the vision and verify I not only have edge, but understand how to use it. Furthermore the purpose of this is to start a business and help with funding of that business. Lastly, the reason for this besides the obvious of scaling the business faster and making more efficient use of my time the additional reasons are: (A) It greatly reduces the risk of failure and allows to size down while still making the necessary income for me to be able to put all my focus in trading. Yes, I realize I can't just leave my job, but I'll be on a lot faster path than another route. (B) While not perfect and can still happen, it still removes a large part of the data issues that happen on a pretty consistent basis on the prop firm account. (C) It will either immediately or if not for certain in the future lead to better commission structure. It's also very possible I am not a super stud trader to the level you describe, by no means am I perfect or think I am some type of prodigy, not at all, but am better than most(at least when it comes to retail which I realize isn't necessarily great, you have to be to even have a shot) and know under the right conditions I have strong probability to consistently over time produce what I need, using appropriate risk management. (2) The bases of how I trade is using my logical abilities and pattern recognition. Not necessarily in the standard or simple sense. Sure in hindsight trading it could be construed as some type of standard pattern, but in live trading unrealistic to catch consistently unless you're actively expecting for price to do something, having it do it and than preparing for your entry upon your chosen entry method(which you don't even necessarily have to have, but there are some PA entry methods I find effective for favorable R/R. Also, noticing a slight a deviation from the current patterns, which is indicative of a possible directional move being over or a new way of delivering price starting, which means I'll most likely remain flat until am able to determine it again. That's the basis. I do over lay this with other confluences, like for one example a consistent mathematical way to calculate means reversion levels that were created based upon other means reversion levels failing to being reverted to. But that is the basis, without listing every single thing I use in detail. There's someone else keeping track of other things to lesson the information burden and allowing me to focus more on the execution. (3) I'd rather not disclose the exact amount in the prop firm on the forum. Of course nothing is guaranteed, but the point stands it would be a high probability that I could produce the income I am looking for if I was able to withdrawal it. Fully understand everything you said regarding this and it's also my concern. I don't believe I'll be paid out the large sum, but again without getting too specific on that it will be roughly 2 months before there's a definitive conclusion to that. I have no choice but to proceed as if that won't happen. (4) You mentioned you need to trade live funds. I feel I need to as well, for all the reasons and issues I listed previously regarding the SIM environment (to refresh mainly the data integrity and commissions). Not sure people realize how much delayed fills and commissions can eat into you. Even with this if I could be guaranteed I would be paid out, there's a good probability that I could work through those issues. (5) Yes, you mentioned topstep but they have a daily loss limit. I need to make about $2.5-$3k a day (on average obviously) to be able to focus on trading exclusively(you need a buffer and multiplier to leave you can't just obviously replace your base income and quit, think you understand this, but not sure if anyone else reading this thread will). Not here to fool myself or anyone else, I cannot do that on a $2,000.00 or $4,500.00 account balance, that doesn't even factor in the daily loss limit(so really $1,000.00 to $3,000.00 balance). Sure, if I build up the account slowly over time and hope or get them to remove the daily loss limit, it's possible. That could take some time. If people ultimately determine I don't have the skill or don't deserve a "short cut" fair enough, but if they can also benefit from this, not sure why you would be begrudge someone. Trading is a business so I don't necessarily believe there's need to be a stigma to separate it from other businesses, outside of the fact that it obviously is one of the more difficult ones to succeed in. Below I will try to do more rapid fire answers: *Been looking / into the markets for about 3.5 years now, started with crypto, but only been trading futures markets for about 1.5 years, with good improvements coming in the last 6 months, with strong improvements in the last two. *I met someone on discord who swore to me he knew a lot of about the markets and just had discipline issues which he claimed was the only reason he couldn't make money and convinced me to work with him. Didn't really know any better so agreed because of that and also out of curiosity. Surprisingly turns out he was more correct than not, although he was still missing some pieces to trading, but together we eventually filled those in. So, I did not necessarily do it alone no. I feel like that person cut down my learning curve a lot. Thanks for reading all of this. I know it was a lot. I hope I delivered on my side as far as adding clarity.
You realize your very first statement is something I already admitted to right? To me if I was reading it I feel like it would be clear (even without the power of hindsight since it's coming from myself). However, as I said enough people disagreed with that, so the most logical and highest probability scenario is that it indeed was unclear. So I admit that. No, I am not searching for a mentor. I think I am starting to see how people operate here so I want to say that statement is NOT to be construed to say I know everything about trading or not willing to deepen my understanding and learn further. I do believe $30k could be worth it, if you could confirm the person giving the course or lesson knows what they are doing. I certainly don't have 30k to spend on a course. Lastly I can appreciate we're all different, but I would not spend any type of substantial money for course or lessons unless that person could show me trading in real time over at least a couple of days. I do not care about all the hindsight charts and calls people make and try to pass off as some type of analysis, it's absolutely ridiculous. .
I was going to just move on from this thread and potentially site in general, but than someone posted and some of the things they said piqued my interest, so am now replying to people the best I can, but may miss someone. To answer your first question, it's slightly to moderately more drawdown than traditional account and it's static not trailing. So sounds great I know, however the rules of when you can place trades, sizing, trades you can place in a certain amount of time and etc are way more strict. Even to the point where it's debatable if it's better than the other accounts particularly depending on how you trade. I've received some money from it but it is not viable long term for me personally. Hopefully am able to withdrawal funds eventually from other one. If I am still around this site at that time I'll let you know how it goes.
I answered this in the post I just made above. More liberal on the drawdown and it's static(which I know is huge), but same thing they reserve the right to close the account at any point and there's A LOT of rules regarding when and how you can trade. Even down to the ATR movement and etc.
I've made some post since than to clarify and also admitted my post wasn't as clear as I perceived it, since every single person said the same thing. Logically I can accept I was most likely incorrect and apologize for that. For further clarity my job is really flexible, so I am able to essentially trade what a lot of people would consider full time hours. Not complaining at all, just clarifying when I do trade it's just delaying my work and I have to do it later. All that combined with a family is a lot, so ultimately yes am looking to move full time. So, it isn't to be construed that I am considering just up and leaving my job. Lastly from the data I am seeing, it appears I do have an actual edge. So it also isn't to be construed that I am looking to gamble or that I have delusions of grandeur. I am aware of the many pitfalls of trading, particularly day trading and how difficult it is.
I think I've since than answered and clarified some of this, but since just out of curiosity I'll type this out trying to put myself in your shoes or vice versa. -The majority of your trading work was with a broker and you just learned it's possible you can't withdrawal the funds. We can debate that I didn't do enough research so it's my fault, fair enough but doesn't change the situation. -You could scale and be more efficient and potentially earn more time(regardless if you don't need or want to use the additional financial earnings to buy more material things, it still helps you earn time) with less overall risk and a substantially increased probability of success. IE: For simple example making $1.00 with $10.00 as an inherently higher risk profile than making $1.00 with $100.00 if we use a reasonable and equal timeline of let's say one day. If your automated trading is making "x" with "x", if it can support "xx" and make "xx" that can potentially be beneficial. -Allow yourself ability to get lower commissions. -Benefits would be industry standard or discussed and agreed upon just like any other business transaction. Hopefully that clarifies.