I'm not anti-American, I'm anti-YOU. You're not America, you don't represent America, your just an angry, scared individual living in America. The notion that disagreeing with you or your kind is anti-American is ridiculous, it's like saying that being anti-Blair is the same as being anti-European. I've hardly even mentioned international law, you're the one who keeps bringing that up. Considering the fact that international law is not really working (just see what it has done for the Palestinians), I'm more concerned about the US constitution and the way your governments keeps treating it like "just a piece of paper" as your great leader have said. Wrong. My estimate was 99% of the killing in the war on terror. I stand by that estimate and if you challenge it, you're welcome to provide the numbers that show otherwise. Wrong again. Benny Morris is a fierce Zionist who holds that the Palestinians are savages who deserve no better. The rest of the sources I provided are mostly Zionists as well, although they are able to do their jobs as historians without letting politics get in the way. Their revision is based on IDF archives which tells the entire story from Israels point of view. Other scholars like Norman Finkelstein criticizes them for only using Israeli sources and just ignoring other parts that are only documented by the other sides. I challenge you to give me a list of 10 historians who deny the claim that a population transfer (whether planned or not is irrelevant) took place. There is the notorious liar with an open Zionist agenda Efraim Karsh - I know about him. Who else is there? Instead of taking on any of the facts I've put forth, you dismiss it as being "boring"? Is this really it? You've got nothing else? Answer me these simple questions: Why does the US support Israel unconditionally in building the security-fence when this fence eats up huge parts of Palestinian land (land that is not recognized as Israeli land)? Why doesn't the US government tell Israel that they will only support the fence if it's built on the boarders? Why is the US always blocking UN resolutions concerning this fence (at the orders of AIPAC) when the US obviously would never accept a Mexican fence eating up huge amounts of US land? Why is the US doing nothing about the new settlements that keeps popping up on Palestinian land? Sure they say they're concerned about it, but no one has ever done anything about it. While American tax money keeps financing it. Explain this to me.
1. I am glad you backtracked on yet another one of your promises to post multiple examples of US violations of international law in the Middle East prior to 9/11. 2. I am not going to discuss Israel's policies in this thread. This thread was about muslim inventions and you turned it into a discussion about the US policies. Your desperate attempts to now turn it into a discussion of Israel's policies is an obvious red-herring. If you want to discuss Israel's policies - start a new thread and if you learn to be pithy (O'Reilly's favorite word), perhaps I will participate. 3. Regarding The US, Middle East and terrorism: we know that you, Osama and muslim fanatics (in no particular order) disagree with our policies. Guess what, that's too bad. Your, Osama's and the Arab street's disapproval does not make our policies any less viable, moral or legitimate. It's the American (not arab) street that determines the policies of the United State of America. All of you have every right to criticize our policies, whine about them on the internet or use any other peaceful and civilized means to make us change our policies. There are no guarantees of course. I can promise that we will listen to you if you present your case in a civilized manner but we may still disagree with you. What you don't have any right to do is murder our civilians (and military personnel either) just because you disagree with our policies that are completely within the norms of international law and standard practices. It's as simple as that. There is absolutely no excuse and no justification for the actions of muslim fanatics. People all over the world are angry at policies of other states. I am angry at France for its ties with Syria, I am angry at the entire muslim world for their unconditional support of the Palestinians. The Ukrainians, the Poles, the Baltic states are angry at Russia, the Israelis are angry at Iran, the Tibetans are angry at China... But it's only muslim fanatics who pillage, riot, murder, behead, kidnap innocent civilians when they are angry at legitimate policies of sovereign states. And it's only complete idiots like you who try to explain and justify their actions by the fact that they are angry at the Great and Little Satan. This is no excuse. 4. As far as this thread is concerned - you told us that the arab street is angry at us because we support Israel and have ties with the Saudi Royal family. Guess what, we know that, tell us something we don't know. You tried of course but your accusations of violations of international law and your claims that we do 99% of the killing fell apart under minimal scrutiny.
im curious....what is the definition of ' ARAB" by your standards? I understand the muslim part but what do you consider 'ARAB"? IS it coming from one of the ARAB nations of today? a few thousand years ago???
I am not sure if the question was addressed to me but if it was I'd be quite generous - anyone who lives or whose roots can be traced to the arab world (or arab communities elsewhere) and who self-identifies as arab is an arab.
How about the I.E.D.?? I also think they invented those big baskets they carry on their heads that the snakes come out of.
Harems Belly dancing Veils Polygamy A legal code The number zero Khat Hot Muslim women who know how to act like a woman, not a half-male bloated feminazi Lots of great art, music & literature
Huh? Jesus self-identified as a jew, give the guy the benefit of the doubt. Moreover there were no arabs in the holy land 2000 years ago, there were jews and Romans, the land was not part of the arab world at that time geographically or ethnically. The arabs invaded and occupied the land of the Jews and claimed its ownership many many centuries later.
Again you assign me opinions that are easier for you to refute in order to have anything to say at all. I never promised anything about international law, i promised that I would explain to you what the US have been doing to middle eastern people that, if done to americans, or any other people in the world for that matter, would provoke similar reactions. So far I've only covered the people of the Southern Levant, although the whole thing with Jerusalem being given away from Muslims to invaders by the international community (including the US) has been reason enough to upset many Muslims around the world. Of course you're not. As I said earlier, you cannot do that without either admitting some rather ugly stuff or throw reason and logic out the window. Now, whether the transfer plan of the Arabs was planned and executed by Zionist top leaders or not would be something we really could discuss; that's a subject with some wiggling room. Whether the expulsion took place however, is an irrefutable truth that virtually all scholars agree upon because of the heavy documentation - and the simple fact that Palestinians where there at one point in history, and not in another. This thread is not about a sincere interest in Muslim inventions, it's about claiming that Muslims are savages and barbarians. The only way I know how to refute that is by explaining why some Muslims are angry and that Americans in their place would react in a similar way. But hey, if you're honest about debating it if I simply copy and paste the claims I've done into a new thread, I can do that too. You don't represent America. There's no "we" here, only you. I'm asking you to explain to me what you would do if somebody came and stole your land and how you would feel about those who financed and supported those invaders. I want you to answer this question on behalf of yourself, not America. Because I don't see you as an average American; most Americans I've talked to are not religious fanatics like yourself. When they study the history and understand the reality of a situation, they're rational about it, they don't use every trick in the book in order to change it to fit their distorted views like you do. I don't represent the people who attack Americans and I certainly don't support them. I'm simply telling you that pushing people this way WILL provoke attacks no matter what god they pray to. If the US supported for instance the Sames up here - if you gave them guns, intel, advice and your blessings in removing my people and establishing their own state over my land, while blocking every attempt to bring justice by the international community, I assure you I would have some problems with the US. I would never attack civilians, but I'm sure a portion of my some million fellow citizens would be crazy enough. It's got nothing to do with religion, it's humanity. Even though you know absolutely nothing about the situation. It's a good thing you don't react on that anger; God does not appreciate ignorance. Wrong. First of all, an estimate of more than a billion people of the people on this planet are Muslims. This means that when you do something that gets to a very large part of them, it is inevitable that a very small portion (even hundreds of thousands are a very small portion when talking about large numbers like this), will react in virtually every way imaginable. This is how humanity has always been; some people are screwed up, some people are capable of doing the worst things imaginable to fellow humans even for petty things like drawings (although nobody got beheaded for the cartoons, it could well have happened). And seccond, kidnappings of innocent people, murdering of civilians, beheadings, riots and pillaging are happening all over the world all the time amongst all peoples. It's just not as hot news when a Russian group beheads a Muslim for being Muslim as it is when a Muslim group beheads a Russian. The worlds eye is directed at the Islamic world in general and Islamic radicalism in particular these days, and so it is only natural that the weakest of us are fooled into believing something is a norm when it's actually not. The reality is, most Muslims are like these: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbcmPe0z3Sc Muslims who are peaceful are extremely boring as you can see. Why would the evening news do a report on them every night? The fact that you seem to think I'm trying to justify anything, indicates that you think getting raped, tortured, massacred and expelled from your land, and then getting raped, tortured and murdered once more in your refugee camps, would justify killing innocent people. It does not for me; hurting an innocent person is very wrong no matter what you've been through. I'm beginning to understand you now, this mentality explains why you don't have a bigger problem with your government murdering some 30-40 000 innocent Iraqis in response to 911. You're as sick as the terrorists, and if you didn't have a government that killed all these innocent people for you, you probably would have blown up yourself you sick fuck. No it didn't, it is still standing; read my last post. I challenged you to provide the numbers that makes the estimate fall apart. Bring it.
Not only Jews, Canaanites were in the area at the time as well. Some archaeologists like Israel Finkelstein at Tel Aviv University even argues that the Israelites did not come out of Egypt; that they emerged from the Canaanites in the 7th century B.C., which would explain why Ashkenazim Jews are genetically closer to modern people in the Levant (Lebanese, Palestinians, Jordanians) than they are to any European people. At the time the Arabs came, it was not "the land of the Jews", it was occupied by the Byzantines and settled by descendants of both Israelites and Canaanites, and the Arabs did not replace the indigenous population by expulsion nor by extermination, so if "Arab" is an ethnicity, and the people in the Levant are Arabs, it would mean that Jews, and therefor Jesus, are a little Arab as well. However, the term "Arab" is not used for any ethnicity today, it is used to describe all those who use the Arabic written language, a language that very much resembles ancient Hebrew but is not by definition the same. So calling Jesus an Arab is a confusing, useless stretch at best. Classifying him by the term "Semite" which also encompassed the Arabs is a much better way to put it.