Libertarian Country?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Rearden Metal, Apr 2, 2004.

Which Nation is currently closest to the Libertarian ideal?

  1. U.S.A.

    9 vote(s)
    13.8%
  2. Canada

    5 vote(s)
    7.7%
  3. Bahamas

    4 vote(s)
    6.2%
  4. Costa Rica

    1 vote(s)
    1.5%
  5. Monaco

    9 vote(s)
    13.8%
  6. Netherlands

    10 vote(s)
    15.4%
  7. Switzerland

    14 vote(s)
    21.5%
  8. Other

    13 vote(s)
    20.0%
  1. http://www.private-islands.com/sales_islands/sites/pricelist.html

    This is interesting, although I'm not sure any of these could become a sovereign nation. If only I was much richer, I could build a truly free country. Never quit dreaming of freedom!

    EDIT: This whole idea would be alot more challenging than I thought. That bubble-era Ameritrade tow truck driver commercial was all lies!

    From a private island website:

    The Republic of... what??
    There's something special about a private island. An isolated piece of paradise, its beaches and forests yours alone to enjoy. A virtual private kingdom under the sun. While this is enough for most of us, for some, only a real kingdom (or republic, or principality, or …) will suffice. For these folks, a private island is but a means to an end - the establishment of a new, independent country. But is such a thing really possible?

    The short answer is a pretty conclusive ' no'. Since the early 20th century, every square foot of dry land on Earth has been claimed by at least one country or another, which pretty much rules out discovering an unmapped tropical paradise, planting your flag, and setting yourself up as the local sovereign. Similarly, existing countries are more than a little reluctant to part with pieces of their national territory, no matter the financial incentives offered. However, 30 years ago one man hatched an enterprising (if a little bizarre) scheme at getting around these little details.

    Site Sponsor



    In the early 1970s a Las Vegas real estate millionaire by the name of Michael Oliver decided to set up his own South Pacific island nation. Given the tragic shortage of unclaimed private islands, Mr. Oliver planned to do the next best thing: build one. This wasn't as crazy as it may at first sound. Under international law, a country may only claim sovereignty over islands which lie outside its territorial waters if the islands are at least a foot above the high tide point (no part-time islands need apply). Mr. Oliver located a submerged coral atoll called the Minerva Reefs, lying 260 miles (420 km) southwest of the Pacific island kingdom of Tonga. At low tide, the Minerva Reefs were exposed to the open air, but at high tide, they were submerged. The reefs lay outside the territorial waters of all nearby states, and as they were submerged at high tide, no country could claim them as an extension of their national territory.

    The plan was this: build up the Minerva Reefs until they remained above the waterline at high tide, thereby officially becoming a new island, outside the jurisdiction of any existing country. Initially, two 7.5 acre (3 ha) islands were to be created, and once the new country was declared, investment dollars would flood in, funding the expansion of the islands to 2,500 acres (1011 ha), or more than twice the size Monaco. Simple enough on paper.

    In 1971 an Australian dredging ship was hired, and work was begun. Soon enough, parts of the reefs were permanently above the high tide mark, and on January 19, 1972 the new "Republic of Minerva" was proclaimed. It wasn't much to look at. No homes, businesses or anything else you'd normally associate with a country - just a few acres of dry, barren land peeking out from the Pacific. It did have a flag, though, and it began issuing its own coinage.

    Unfortunately for Mr. Oliver, neither investment dollars nor international recognition was forthcoming. In fact, the only country to react to the proclamation of the new "Republic" was the neighbouring Kingdom of Tonga - and it wasn't thrilled. Tonga's monarch, King Taufa'ahau Tupou IV, decided to throw his weight behind eradicating the upstart new island. (At over 400 pounds (200 kg), His Majesty held the Guinness Book of World Records title for heaviest monarch, so this threat was not to be taken lightly.)

    A Tongan force comprising 90 members of a prisoner work detail, as well as a 4-piece band, made the voyage to the new island. Upon landing, the party hauled down the Minervan flag, played a rousing version of the Tongan national anthem, and claimed the land for Tonga. The short-lived "Republic of Minerva" was dead.

    The moral of the story? If you're fortunate enough to own a private island, by all means enjoy your "private kingdom" - just don't be foolish enough to call it that. Especially if you're anywhere near Tonga.
    http://www.privateislandsonline.com/article2.htm
     
    #11     Apr 2, 2004
  2. Why would you need any taxes at all other than on sales tax on the drugs and hookers (for tourists)?

    Reardon, here's another idea. Every citizen you invite has some kind of diplomatic position. Immunity the world over! And a cool looking passport design is an important issue to think about too.

    Since everyone would have diplomatic immunity maybe the cover of the passport should be a raised fist with a protruding middle finger. It would really be fun to show that passport to customs guys the world over. LOL

    Peace,
    :)RS
     
    #12     Apr 3, 2004
  3. You can see the shores of St.Martin/St.Maarten - the french/dutch split island - from Anguilla any day. On the dutch side there are a lot of hotels with a many US tourists and some casinos.

    Then a little further you have St.Barths with more jet-setters. If you sail/fly a little away you have the even more exclusive Marthinique.

    Belive me, you will not miss anything on the beaches of St.Martin, Orient beach is a mixed nude/semi-nude beach with lotsa bars, and on the shores off the island you can envy all those yachts with helicopter decks.
    You can sign up for a day of jetskiing around the island with a group, stopping at various points. Then there is the excellent Moorings and other offering sailboats, chefs and all-girl crew if you like.
    Marigot Bay on the french side has some really good restaurants.
    You won't miss a thing, if you really like to spend. The french/dutch combination is priceless ...
    :)

    For private islands, I think that there were some islands around the Belize area for sale .. might be a bit pricey. Otherwise, you can get armed to the teeth and go to some of the phillipine backwaters, or perhaps the Micronesia area. However, I doubt you will get much out of the luxury-life department there, unless you can fly in your stuff regularly. But then you'd be rich enough to pay someone to fix your taxes for you, I guess.
    :D
     
    #13     Apr 3, 2004

  4. Personally, I'm most enamoured with Canada's "libertarian" tax rates.
     
    #14     Apr 3, 2004
  5. Other = "None of the above"
     
    #15     Apr 10, 2004
  6. Cutten

    Cutten

    My vote is for the high seas, or Antarctica. You can do pretty much what the f*ck you like, as long as you don't kill or attack anyone - you can legally carry assault rifles and RPGs for self-defence, there are no taxes, and no politicians. Ok, so it is a bit cold and lonely, but are you telling me you won't shiver a bit for your principles?

    I'd also like to know what you were smoking when you put Canada on the list!

    It should be replaced by somewhere that has no effective government, but is not a total warzone - for example Western Sahara, or Somalia outside Mogadishu.
     
    #16     Apr 10, 2004
  7. Cutten

    Cutten

    Oh, and if you want to start you own country, forget about private islands. Just go to Africa, and pay a dictatorial/corrupt government to sell you the sovereign rights in perpetuity to a "small bit" ("small" in Africa means about the size of Florida) of mineral rich coastal land. There is a precedent in international law for for corrupt dictators selling sovereign rights in perpetuity - Louisiana and Alaska for starters. Then hire Sandline or some other private military contractor to look after defence for the first few years, and pretty soon you'll be invulnerable to invasion by any neighbouring powers (don't set up next to South Africa or Nigeria).

    Your open borders, tax-free status, English-based common law & property rights, and most importantly your refusal to randomly jail and kill normal people will guarantee a huge and continual flow of immigrants fleeing African tyranny, poverty, and civil strife, resulting in the highest population growth in recorded history. Multinationals will flock to invest in your secure low-hassle mining and tourism industry, and others will base their Africa HQs there (especially mercenary companies, who are hated everywhere else). Legalise and scap taxes on all gambling, drugs, re-export (i.e. smuggling), precious metals, pornography, consenting sexual services, arms (except WMDs) and luxury goods. Pretty soon your capital will be the most expensive city in Africa, skyscrapers will be going up faster than TASR, and people will no longer by referring to Las Vegas when they talk about "Sin City".

    Next, wait for one of your neigbhours to degenerate into anarchy, coup, or civil war. Then offer to send in a protection force in lieu of UN peacekeeping. If the UN disapprove, arrest the 17 Bangladeshi tuk-tuk drivers they bothered to send, annex the place and put a referendum to the populace as to whether they want to join your "United States of Africa", with a free $100 voucher for everyone who votes yes. One years wages and freedom for all, or another few decades of chaos and repression? Tough call. Do this a few times, and within 3 decades your country will control at least 10% of the African landmass, have one of the highest GDP per capita levels outside the Western World (actually probably higher than France and Canada at least), be a tourist mecca, have all the cheap hard drugs you can handle, and be packed full of the finest teenage punnany you'll find this side of the Atlantic.

    Disadvantages are AIDS, insects the size of small automobiles, and nasty tropical diseases. So set up an insecticidal condom manufacturer with a customer loyalty scheme featuring free AZT doses for bulk purchasers :D

    That's my plan - any takers?
     
    #17     Apr 10, 2004
  8. <b>For sale: World's smallest country with sea view</b>

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070109/od_nm/island_dc

    LONDON, Jan 8 (Reuters Life!) - For sale: the world's smallest country with its own flag, stamps, currency and passports.

    Apply to Prince Michael of Sealand if you want to run your own nation, even if it is just a wartime fort perched on two concrete towers in the North Sea.

    Built in World War Two as an anti-aircraft base to repel German bombers, the derelict platform was taken over 40 years ago by retired army major Paddy Roy Bates who went to live there with his family.

    He declared the platform, perched seven miles off the east coast of England and just outside Britain's territorial waters, to be the principality of Sealand.

    The self-styled Prince Roy adopted a flag, chose a national anthem and minted silver and gold coins.

    The family saw off an attempt by Britain's Royal Navy to evict them and also an attempt in 1978 by a group of German and Dutch businessmen to seize Sealand by force.

    Roy, 85, now lives in Spain and his son Michael told BBC Radio on Monday his family had been approached by estate agents with clients "who wanted a bit more than a bit of real estate, they wanted autonomy."

    He suggested Sealand, which has eight rooms in each tower, could be a base for online gambling or offshore banking.

    Asked to describe the delights of living on what he described as a cross between a house and a ship, the 54-year-old said: "The neighbors are very quiet. There is a good sea view."
     
    #18     Jan 9, 2007
  9. Lol, you'd prefer a place where growing gills wasnt necessary for survival though, right?:D

    Fact is, a yacht is the only real option, but the $20,000,000 price tag for a serious vessel isnt exactly good value, for something you can still get seasick on.

    As far as the high seas go, sounds good in theory, but you'd still be subject to every rule/law/local contrivance of every port you pull into.

    Still............i can always dream.

    http://www.yachtboutique.com/Designers/JFR/Vectra.htm
     
    #19     Jan 9, 2007
  10. Possibly Taiwan?
     
    #20     Jan 9, 2007