Discussion in 'Retail Brokers' started by Grabbit, Dec 5, 2001.

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  1. dkamp

    dkamp Guest

    Okay, here's what I'm getting from the SL4 responses so far:

    - most of what's cool about it is "proprietary" and can't be revealed
    - they're exploring emini trading but aren't ready to reveal the results yet, or to explain how it might be helped by SL4
    - they haven't bothered to create a feature by feature comparison with TS yet, even though TS would be a major competitor (I agree though that TS's current revenue model is a dumb one)
    - they don't support something like EL, since their proprietary advances make it unnecessary (?)
    - their support for automated trading involves an API that requires you to do all the real work

    That's all okay, but wake me up when SL4 is something that I can actually make use of, and without the answer to the most interesting questions being that its "proprietary".

    (xcowboy - this is just a reality check from an emini trader using TS - I'm hopefull that SL4 will truly be great and is something that I'll be able to use - thanks for all your feedback and keep us informed)
    #41     Dec 16, 2001
  2. mjt



    I decided not to delete this thread when it became a lively discussion amongst several members. If someone who is pushing software or some other service continues to make posts about their product, without others showing any indication of interest by posting and asking questions, I think that's when you have to call it unwanted (free) advertisement.

    To clarify, if anyone is interested, the main reason to keep an eye out for unwanted advertising is to keep this a free site. Baron has to pay for this site by sponsors, who understandably get upset if they see their competitors getting free advertising by posting messages. If this happens often enough, they might pull their advertising, and bye bye Elite Trader.
    #42     Dec 16, 2001
  3. xcowboy


    If a trader needs to know how SL4 does what it does in order to use it, then I can tell you right now, look elsewhere. However, to us that would be like saying, "well, I don't believe the breaks will actually stop the car unless I actually understand how they work and how to build breaks myself". It is always said that a picture is worth 1,000 words. I must say it is getting a bit frustrating trying to explain something that can best be conveyed through a simple 5-day free trial. People here keep talking as if they have something to lose just by trying it. Why should we start explaining how SL4 analyzes order flow and attributes it to the various participants and how that information is intercorrolated to other factors in order to generate a trend bias? Will that help someone become a better trader? Will that information get someone else to sign up for SL4, or EVEN TRY IT IF THEY HAVEN'T BOTHERED TO ALREADY? Or will it simply help give others ideas to go off and use for their own purposes (not that they would get very far)? Either way, the methods used would be much too complex and would in fact be inappropriate for discussion in this forum. In order to see if SL4 will help for E-Mini trading, again, sign up for the free trial and make your own decision. See if the trend bias signals generated on the E-Minis can help you. You may not be able to execute E-Minis yet on SL4 (only because arrangements have not yet been finalized with a Futures Broker), but that does not mean it cannot be evaluated for that purpose. If dkamp and others don't want to take the time to check out a free demo, what else can we say? Those who'd rather put down IB rather than just go and make a direct evaluation were left paying much higher commissions with generally no real advantage. And those who were putting down IB in order to promote their own self-interests (competitors, etc), well, they obviously did not get very far either. We welcome valid questions from those attempting to directly evaluate SL4 in REAL-TIME from those who wish to seriously better understand how to utilize its features and the information provided in REAL-TIME in order to supplement their own trading style. What better proof and verification is there anyway -- forget all this talk -- see it for yourself LIVE and in ACTION and make your own decision...
    #43     Dec 16, 2001
  4. dkamp

    dkamp Guest

    xcowboy: Fair enough. Just wanted to learn as much as possible before spending time with the free demo. And it makes some sense that you should require greater commitment before revealing hard-one secrets. Thanks for the time you've taken to respond to us poking at you. :)
    #44     Dec 16, 2001
  5. DoCo


    xcowboy, I don't trade yet (starting in Jan. with IB) but would like to use SL4 for the real time simulation only...I have Esignal now...how much $ and what do I need to use SL4???
    #45     Dec 16, 2001
  6. xcowboy



    IB has the rates that will allow scalping to work, however we have not yet made arrangements with them...Since you already have Esignal and at least the real time basic version including level II, we can set you up with a free one week demo and initial instructions...you will want to go to www.sl4trader.com and thoroughly go through the tutorials so that you can prepare to make the best use of you demo period...
    #46     Dec 16, 2001
  7. xcowboy



    Once you have completed the demo period, you would need to fund an account with an SL4 BD...LGT charges $100 month for SL4 and currently has a rate schedule featuring $1 minimum , 1 cents per share plus ecn fees...www.letsgotrade.com...is made up of individuals that helped build NDB before they sold to AMTD...
    The average ecn fee will probably be .0025, and although IB is less expensive, their cents per share model will work...their broker to client ratio is better than 50:1 which may reflect on the fact that when you are down for some reason, they may be more responsive in getting you out of a trade than IB...As you know, the margin rules were just changed which will require a $25,000 minimum...which is an exchange rule, not a LGT rule...
    #47     Dec 16, 2001
  8. x,

    You are really not impressing me or anyone else by blowing off a simple question. I'm not asking you to reveal any secrets, just respond to a pretty obvious question. Your system seems to be based in part on how long or short MM's are, but you can't address what appears to be a critical flaw in that logic. Not very confidence inspiring. So what we have is software that doesn't have any backtesting stats because it's just a tool, not a system, but you can't or won't explain how signals are generated either, but on faith we are supposed to waste a week screwing around with a highly complicated product, when there are no brokers anyone has heard of who support it, even if we wanted to use it.
    #48     Dec 16, 2001
  9. Phoenix1


    AAA -- what platform and broker are you using now? I'd be interested in taking some of my time and checking them out. Well, at least as much time as you have been dedicating to your posts here. But then again, if you were satisfied with what you are already using, I guess you wouldn't be hanging around here.
    #49     Dec 17, 2001
  10. Simba


    XCowboy, you stated that...

    <<<...we are broker dealer neutral and will license to deserving brokers who in turn will have to offer commission scales that can work...


    IB has the rates that will allow scalping to work, however we have not yet made arrangements with them...>>>

    Are you working out a deal with IB??? If yes, what is the status???

    Also, in one response you stated that SL4 costs $100 / mo. plus $1.50 per executed trade.

    Now, this is peculiar. A scalper may make a thousand trades (round-trips) per month. If the charge is $1.50 per round trip, this would cost $750 / mo., and if the charge is $1.50 per single trade, this would cost the trader $1,500 / mo. This would seem a very high expense.

    Perhaps I misunderstood this. Please clarify.


    #50     Dec 17, 2001
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