lets be honest

Discussion in 'Trading' started by Halal Burger, Apr 2, 2003.

  1. ok this sounds shit but lets be honest. Why do most of you think you can be successful traders? You all know the probabilities that 90% of traders fail yet most of you reckon you can make it into the 10% of profitable traders. I can only speak from a UK perspective but, there are only 100,000 people (out of a population of 60,000,000) that pay capital gains tax in the UK i.e investment gains. I must admit I looked into the day trading idea but realized it wasn't for me. I trade currencies on the side but make less than £7000 so am not subject to capital gains tax. Its like sport. So many people 'wish' to make it in sport but the realities are that the majority wont. What makes you think you have the abilities to succeed? Most of you have read a few books, been on a training course or worked for a prop firm. This isn't education in trading. If you had the skills you would have been snapped up by a bulge bracket firm. Speaking of bulge bracket firms, Goldman Sachs has 20 propriety traders, just 20!! So, please tell me what drives you to continue trading when the inevitable fact is that you will not succeed, let alone break even?
  2. The main reason probably is that I am still new at this, and while I am making a few hundred dollars a month trading 100-share lots, why should I quit? The only reason why I am not trading 1000-share lots is that I am not confident enough just yet. I spent the last few months slowly migrating from 100 shares per trade to 200, 300, sometimes up to 500. If you make a few thousand pounds per year, why would you think that one couldn't do the exact same thing with ten times the size and make a good living at it?
  3. Where do you get that info? Goldy's proprietary bond department alone, London office, is responsible for a major % of their total income. A friend of mine used to work in that office years ago and they had a few dozen, in that department alone.

    BTW, people trade just like they try any profession. How many doctors get to be brain surgeons? I would say far less than 10% of the people who set out to do this at the beginning of med school.

  4. Mecro


    I trade for a prop firm and I have been doing good so far. My dad is a successful trader so I guess it is in the genes.

    Plus it is damn fun and the work environment is great.

    Big firms, like Goldman Sachs would not know WTF made a good proprietary trader if their lives depended on it. Salomon Brothes back in 1980s proved that Ivy league educations meant absolute squat when it came to the markets. Yet big firms still only hire Ivy League booksmart graduates.
  5. exce26


    Which firm are you in & why?
  6. Halal Burger,

    I like the sports analogy...

    the very inaccurate statement you made is...

    If you had the skills you would have been snapped up by a bulge bracket firm.

    when in fact that most successful retail traders trade for themselves and are well capitalized.

    Therefore, there's no need for them to do any type of job hunting :cool:

    Now...back to your sports analogy...

    if you've played any level of competitive sports you already know the answer why traders get up every morning to trade.

    Also...you should already know that you don't have to be the best nor among the best traders to make a living in this market.

    Something else I saw that was odd in your statement...

    almost like a slip of the tongue...

    you said...inevitable fact

    you said...will not succeed

    you said...let alone break even

    the above is a loser mentality or self-defeating words.

    By the way...how's your trading?

  7. cartm


    This is what I have been wondering for quite some time. Where in stone is it written that 90% of traders lose money. Was there a scientific study done to contribute to this fact. (or opinion depending on your point of view) I am not saying this is not true, it may very well be, but where is it documented?

    And how reliable is it? And what type of trading does it refer to, scalping, swing trading? Different mkts, stocks, bonds, options, futures commodities? And did it account for the fact that people do have drawdowns, or slumps, whatever you want to call them in their trading career?

    I have seen this % used so liberally I am just wondering where the foundation for it lies :confused:
  8. I just did a little research. Goldy has hundreds of traders involved in the following: fixed income, equity, currencies, commodities, swaps and derivatives, and emerging areas such as weather trading. Trading and related operations accounted for 38% of total income last year (over 5 billion from trading).

    Maybe they just have 20 traders in the one department you looked at in London.

  9. it's the american dream in perhaps its purest form. The biggest barriers to entry are belief and hard work.
  10. bone

    bone ET Sponsor

    Burger: Speak for yourself.

    Be kind.

    If you are participating in this forum, you also fancy yourself a trader, and by your calculus you will in all likelihood fail. But alas, you probably think you are special and that you will defy the odds. But are you more special than me? All humans deserve a fair shot at their dreams.

    Besides, I trade against the market. I do not compete against you. I compete against a distillation of opinion regarding price that is captured in a moment in time.

    So go copulate with your hand. Alone and angry. And leave the dreamers alone. Your venom does not further your ambitions. I support a large family off of my trading. I do it for a living. I am a dreamer.
    #10     Apr 2, 2003