King Obama: The Fall

Discussion in 'Politics' started by gwb-trading, May 3, 2013.

  1. It has been tried HUNDREDS of times before... and has NEVER succeeded.

    I once read a story from a history professor... who listed 316 prior cases of trying to "[debase currency]/print your way to prosperity/out of debt". The results were 0-316!

    How can any thinking person believe it will be any different this time?
     
    #51     May 7, 2013
  2. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    Hint: The answer to your question lies in the first part of this sentence.
     
    #52     May 7, 2013
  3. Lucrum

    Lucrum

    Buckwheat speaks (posts) with no thought beforehand whatsoever. Hence he doesn't even know what he was trying to say.
     
    #53     May 7, 2013
  4. Ricter

    Ricter

    First Take: What's driving commodities' drop?
    John Waggoner, USA TODAY11:35 a.m. EDT April 15, 2013

    "If you're worried about inflation, world financial markets have something to say to you: You're looking in the wrong direction.

    "Gold, the world's premier inflation-fighter, has plunged nearly $200 an ounce the past two trading days. It's now down 25% from its 2011 high. Silver has fallen more than 9% in frenetic trading Monday.

    "Futures prices for copper – sometimes called the commodity with a Ph.D. in inflation – fell 3.6% overnight, according to CRB Fundamental Market Service. Oil has fallen below $90 a barrel, to $88.50, lowest since Dec. 21.

    [GOLD: Keeps falling Monday]

    "The collapse in commodity markets signals worldwide weak economic demand, which was confirmed by China's GDP report Monday.

    "China's GDP rose 7.7% -- a monster move in every nation but China, where analysts were calling for 8% growth or better. The lower figure means lower demand from Asia.

    "With China slowing and Europe in recession, it seems unlikely the U.S. , with its anemic economic growth, will be able to pick up the slack. And that means lower prices.

    "What's wrong with lower prices? In a weak economy, lower prices lead to even lower prices, which means deflation. Ultimately, it means companies that can't slash prices are forced out of business, which leads to further economic weakness.

    "The Federal Reserve has been trying to fight deflation and keep the economy growing with rock-bottom interest rates and a program of buying longer-term bonds to keep interest rates low. Currently, the Treasury market is signaling that the Fed could have a long way to go: The yield on the 10-year Treasury note swooned to 1.72% Monday morning. "

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/business/2013/04/15/first-take-deflation/2083733/
     
    #54     May 7, 2013
  5. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    1. WTI (Oil) just crossed $96 as of this posting. Your article's numbers are a temporary correction, seized to try to make a (false) point. Edit: 96.20 and rising.

    2. Spot gold reclaimed 66% of it's loses (to the fibo) and while it's drop was the greatest in 30 years, it existed in the paper market only, as someone sold some massive naked shorts. Premium to physical jumped some $54 after the drop, meaning physical didn't really move all that much. Same for silver.

    3. The Fed is now purchasing somewhere around 65% of the 10 year market. Hilarious.

    Next article, please. Preferably by someone who understands financial markets, even if they have an opposing view.
     
    #55     May 7, 2013
  6. Ricter

    Ricter

    1)

    <img src="http://www.infomine.com/ChartsAndData/GraphEngine.ashx?z=f&gf=110537.USD.bbl&dr=5y">

    2) Nice story, but the price of gold is down significantly.

    <img src="http://www.kitco.com/LFgif/au1825nyb.gif">

    3) Down from 90%, that's good news.

    It's been several years now, so when exactly is this hyperinflation supposed to kick in?
     
    #56     May 7, 2013
  7. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    Just using the numbers in the oil chart that YOU posted, WTI is up 264% in the three year period from 2009 (the market low). You don't see anything wrong with that? Even if you take the high point of your chart as a reference point and call oil being down over that time frame, you should overlay it with dollar purchasing power and a whole host of other economical statistics to determine if $105 oil is better for the average consumer now than $147 was then, given all of the factors consumers have to deal with now vs. the golden year of 2007. You are, of course, ignoring all that because it doesn't give you the story you want.

    2. I just said that the spot price of gold was down significantly. In fact, I said the worst in 30 years. But you're still ignoring that this is a paper price, influenced by the selling of naked shorts. You can see a huge premium in physical metal, indicative of someone playing games in the paper market that is not reflective of reality. Consider the oil market as an example - the premium to delivery vs. spot is essentially zero.

    If it cost me $10 to actually obtain an item, but the "market" price was saying it was only $6, what is the real price of the item?

    3. Regarding "hyperinflation", I don't recall using that term, but I have referred to substantial inflation. I've also pointed out hundreds of times on this forum (who knows, you could have had me on ignore during that time or just wished you did and not read any of it), that most of this Fed money sits at the banks, and is being used to drive up asset prices (lately this is the stock market). If it ever makes it's way into the general economy (through loans and the like) that is when you will see inflation take off. Until then, it's just cost-push, aka commodity.

    You are also ignoring prices on the shelves of grocery stores, and increases like that. In 2012, IRI and Nielson syndicated data reported something like 2000 price increases, with 4 price declines in segments FDM-x (without Walmart being taken into account). This year, there are considerably less price increases, but no decreases thus far. Food prices go up, they never really go down.
     
    #57     May 7, 2013
  8. Ricter

    Ricter

    <img src="http://inflationdata.com/Inflation/images/charts/Oil/Inflation_Adj_Oil_Prices_Chart.jpg">
     
    #58     May 7, 2013
  9. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    I'm not sure what you're trying to say from showing that chart, are you? You never offer any commentary, just hoping your chart will do what you, perhaps, cannot see? I don't know.

    What I see from that chart is a similar rise (something like 2-300% from the baseline average occurring pre-1986 (minus the one oil shock which had nothing to do with money supply and was a real, genuine supply shock). So what is your point again? That the price of oil has rocketed in the last 20 or so years? If so, then I agree!
     
    #59     May 7, 2013
  10. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    Oh, and incidentally, thank you for proving that the CPI (or in this case, the Urban adjusted metric) has been reduced over the decades as the method of calculation has been revised to eliminate "inflation" over the years. It's quite evident in that chart that "inflation has withered away" at points that line up with hedonics changes by the BLS.

    http://www.shadowstats.com/article/consumer_price_index
     
    #60     May 7, 2013