JACK HERSHEY METHOD EXPOSED AS FRAUD! *Debated*

Discussion in 'Automated Trading' started by bwolinsky, Dec 13, 2008.

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  1. Backtest was from 6/15/2006. When I took it even further back it lost a lot of money to where I had to add a 3% stop to make it work. Even then it only made $8k total since 2004 on $147k. Horrible.

    Jack's into modifying the appearance of his scripts more than making them work.

    <i> I MUST DRAW A LINE!</i>
     
    #11     Dec 15, 2008
  2. I guess I'm missing the close out EOD spot, so I'll have to come back and redo the backtests. But you want to know what I think before I do that? It's not going to help in the least bit. I think that will put it over the edge to unprofitable, even though it's already there.
     
    #12     Dec 15, 2008
  3. Here it is with a sell on the close. It does look like the EOD exit helped results, and I probably don't need the 3% stop anymore:
    for Bar := 5 to BarCount - 1 do
    begin

    var SMADiff : float =(SMA( bar, #close , 20 ) - SMA( bar - 1, #close, 20 ));
    var MACDday : integer = MACDExSeries( #Close, val1, val2 );
    if lastbar(bar) then begin
    lbar:=bar;
    end;
    if (bar>lbar+2) and (gettime(bar)<1600) and (@#Volume[bar]>20000) then begin
    if not (lastpositionactive) and (crossovervalue(bar,HersheyStochK,50)) then begin
    buyatmarket(Bar+1,'Jacks friend scott d says to buy here');
    end;
    if not (lastpositionactive) and (crossundervalue(Bar,HersheyStochK,50)) then begin
    shortatmarket(Bar+1,'Jacks friend scott d says to sellshort here');
    end;
    if (positionlong(lastposition)) and (@HersheyStochK[bar]<@HersheyStochD[bar]) and (crossundervalue(Bar,HersheyStochK,80)) then begin
    sellatmarket(Bar+1,LastPosition,'');
    end;
    if (positionshort(lastposition)) and (@HersheyStochK[bar]>@HersheyStochD[bar]) and (crossovervalue(Bar,HersheyStochK,20)) then begin
    coveratmarket(Bar+1,lastposition,'');
    end;
    if (positionlong(lastposition)) and (abs(@HersheyStochD[bar]-SMA(Bar,HersheyStochD,6))<1.4) then begin sellatmarket(Bar+1,LastPosition,''); end;
    if (positionshort(lastposition)) and (abs(@HersheyStochD[bar]-SMA(Bar,HersheyStochD,6))<1.4) then begin coveratmarket(Bar+1,LastPosition,''); end;
    if (gettime(Bar)=1555) and positionlong(lastposition) then sellatmarket(Bar+1,#All,'');
    if (gettime(Bar)=1555) and positionshort(lastposition) then coveratmarket(Bar+1,#All,'');

    end;
    end;
     
    #13     Dec 15, 2008
  4. The attachment is an exact duplicate of SCOTTD's AKA Jack Hershey TS easylanguage.

    It's written in WL so we have something to work with, and the script has these results, since 6/1/2006:
    </b>Long + Short</b>
    Starting Capital $147,000.00
    Ending Capital $202,751.03
    Net Profit $55,751.03
    Net Profit % 37.93%
    Annualized Gain % 13.49%
    Exposure 0.85%

    Number of Trades 105
    Avg Profit/Loss $530.96
    Avg Bars Held 45.42

    Winning Trades 43
    Winning % 40.95%
    Gross Profit $123,744.15
    Largest Winning Trades $29,588.97
    Avg Profit $2,877.77
    Avg Bars Held 76.26
    Max Consecutive 3

    Losing Trades 62
    Losing % 59.05%
    Gross Loss ($67,993.13)
    Largest Losing Trade ($7,734.99)
    Avg Loss ($1,096.66)
    Avg Bars Held 24.03
    Max Consecutive 5

    Max Drawdown ($48,485.48)
    Max Drawdown Date 10/10/2008
    Max Drawdown % -20.10%
    Max Drawdown % Date 10/10/2008

    APD 19.7908
    APAD 107.2647
    Wealth-Lab Score 1,261.53
    RAR 1,578.97
    MAR 0.6711
    Profit Factor 1.82
    Recovery Factor 1.1498
    Sharpe Ratio 0.9248
    Sortino Ratio 4.845
    Ulcer Index 8.3615
    WL Error Term 5.174
    WL Reward Ratio 2.6078
    Luck Coefficient 10.2819
    Pessimistic Rate of Return 1.3686
    Equity Drop Ratio 0.2989
    K-Ratio 0.0063
    Seykota Lake Ratio 0.065
    Expectancy 0.1546
    Expectancy Score 3.1717
    Max Losers Held 1
    Max Winners Held 1

    <b>Long Only</b>
    Starting Capital $147,000.00
    Ending Capital $150,327.36
    Net Profit $3,327.36
    Net Profit % 2.26%
    Annualized Gain % 0.88%
    Exposure 0.10%

    Number of Trades 53
    Avg Profit/Loss $62.78
    Avg Bars Held 7.96

    Winning Trades 20
    Winning % 37.74%
    Gross Profit $32,642.91
    Largest Winning Trades $9,076.52
    Avg Profit $1,632.15
    Avg Bars Held 12.65
    Max Consecutive 3

    Losing Trades 33
    Losing % 62.26%
    Gross Loss ($29,315.55)
    Largest Losing Trade ($4,225.51)
    Avg Loss ($888.35)
    Avg Bars Held 5.12
    Max Consecutive 5

    Max Drawdown ($15,065.73)
    Max Drawdown Date 9/8/2008
    Max Drawdown % -9.43%
    Max Drawdown % Date 9/8/2008

    APD 3.0609
    APAD 79.576
    Wealth-Lab Score 815.4884
    RAR 900.4178
    MAR 0.0937
    Profit Factor 1.1135
    Recovery Factor 0.2209
    Sharpe Ratio 0.2341
    Sortino Ratio 9.016
    Ulcer Index 2.1072
    WL Error Term 1.32
    WL Reward Ratio 0.6693
    Luck Coefficient 5.5611
    Pessimistic Rate of Return 0.7363
    Equity Drop Ratio 0
    K-Ratio 0.0031
    Seykota Lake Ratio 0.0106
    Expectancy -0.1031
    Expectancy Score -2.4526
    Max Losers Held 1
    Max Winners Held 1

    <b>Short Only</b>
    Starting Capital $147,000.00
    Ending Capital $199,423.67
    Net Profit $52,423.67
    Net Profit % 35.66%
    Annualized Gain % 12.75%
    Exposure 0.78%

    Number of Trades 52
    Avg Profit/Loss $1,008.15
    Avg Bars Held 83.6

    Winning Trades 23
    Winning % 44.23%
    Gross Profit $91,101.25
    Largest Winning Trades $29,588.97
    Avg Profit $3,960.92
    Avg Bars Held 131.57
    Max Consecutive 4

    Losing Trades 29
    Losing % 55.77%
    Gross Loss ($38,677.58)
    Largest Losing Trade ($7,734.99)
    Avg Loss ($1,333.71)
    Avg Bars Held 45.55
    Max Consecutive 6

    Max Drawdown ($48,485.48)
    Max Drawdown Date 10/10/2008
    Max Drawdown % -20.39%
    Max Drawdown % Date 10/10/2008

    APD 30.3035
    APAD 119.0599
    Wealth-Lab Score 1,305.90
    RAR 1,640.28
    MAR 0.6256
    Profit Factor 2.3554
    Recovery Factor 1.0812
    Sharpe Ratio 0.96
    Sortino Ratio 11.775
    Ulcer Index 8.5992
    WL Error Term 4.562
    WL Reward Ratio 2.7957
    Luck Coefficient 7.4702
    Pessimistic Rate of Return 1.5723
    Equity Drop Ratio 0.3181
    K-Ratio 0.0063
    Seykota Lake Ratio 0.075
    Expectancy 0.1649
    Expectancy Score 1.8456
    Max Losers Held 1
    Max Winners Held 1

    You should be able to see that Jack's Script is mostly a short script, and that his longs are ineffective at best, adding no risk adjusted value to the script.
     
    #14     Dec 15, 2008
  5. One thing that stands out is this system is profitable with a win rate below 50%. I agree that this system is not worth the risk but it appears as though there is certainly something to work on here. Improve the weaknesses of this system and we'll probably have something pretty good.
     
    #15     Dec 15, 2008
  6. For comparison purposes, some of my best scripts look like this. The biggest difference is how much larger the APR is compared the drawdown. Jack has failed miserably for years in creating a decent risk adjusted system.

    This is actually what it is supposed to look like, and, it's in the same time period with the exact same settings:
    Long + Short
    Starting Capital $147,000.00
    Ending Capital $304,964.40
    Net Profit $157,964.40
    Net Profit % 107.46%
    Annualized Gain % 33.86%
    Exposure 3.14%

    Cash Interest $17,094.23
    Margin Loan Interest $0.00
    Total Commission ($2,238.00)
    DividendsPaid $0.00

    Number of Trades 68
    Avg Profit/Loss $2,323.01
    Avg Profit/Loss % 1.17%
    Avg Bars Held 3.1

    Winning Trades 59
    Winning % 86.76%
    Gross Profit $212,349.44
    Avg Profit $3,599.14
    Avg Profit % 1.88%
    Avg Bars Held 2.97
    Max Consecutive 14

    Losing Trades 9
    Losing % 13.24%
    Gross Loss ($71,479.27)
    Avg Loss ($7,942.14)
    Avg Loss % -3.50%
    Avg Bars Held 4
    Max Consecutive 1

    Max Drawdown ($39,348.53)
    Max Drawdown Date 10/9/2008
    Max Drawdown % -12.81%
    Max Drawdown % Date 10/9/2008

    Wealth-Lab Score 939.1762
    RAR 1,077.15
    Profit Factor 2.9708
    Recovery Factor 4.0145
    Payoff Ratio 0.5371
    <b>Sharpe Ratio 3.9818</b> Jacks at around 1 is 4 times as risky as this particular system. Thus, why I say, when I have systems of my own that are significantly better than what Jack is putting out there, I really can be quite pessimistic. His system isn't worth the risk that it is taking, and there's much better out there.
    Ulcer Index 2.1978
    WL Error Term 2.452
    WL Reward Ratio 13.8093
    Luck Coefficient 8.4729
    Pessimistic Rate of Return 2.2971
    Equity Drop Ratio 0.0511



    I'd much rather trade this with futures than Jack's no return for the risk taken version.
     
    #16     Dec 15, 2008
  7. I noticed that, too, and it surpised me. I can see improvement, but I don't see a way to improve it to getting APR to DD at parity. It still wouldn't be worth it on that basis.
     
    #17     Dec 15, 2008
  8. Dare I say: Shall I optimize the MACD and curve fit? One thing Jack has always stuck to is the MACD values, both in slow stochastic and the MACD versions. I'm surprised they haven't experimented in TS, because it's much faster than WL at doing that.

    I guess if you've been telling people for so long, what the MAGIC BEAN Numbers are, then you can't change in the middle of it.

    Also, it appears there's more indicators available in the script than what I'm using, so anybody know how to use the
    PVAD score? or the price volume AD whatever score? He also has second derivative junk that doesn't make any sense, but I've not heard him discuss this.

    It appears that these functions are the "Secret Sauce", and I'll have to look here http://wl4.wealth-lab.com/cgi-bin/WealthLab.DLL/viewfamily?family=Jack Hershey Equities Method to see what they're doing with those indicators.
     
    #18     Dec 15, 2008
  9. Don't suppose you'd like to post the code for this one? :D

     
    #19     Dec 15, 2008
  10. :D What'd you think the answer was?:D It's for sale, and I sell subscriptions to it at www.collective2.com/go/pairsqidqld

    Granted, I've had to improve it every now and then. That link will take you to the first two versions, and I've only recently started to use this one after the hiatus. Too bad the DD was on the first trade I tried with it, after going through another DD with the second version.

    Kind of the evolving aspect to the system went:

    static overbought oversold to
    volatility based overbought oversold
    and then to
    futures volatility based integration overbought oversold
     
    #20     Dec 15, 2008
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