Is this fair? Is it common? I want to know.

Discussion in 'Order Execution' started by dpg2020, Jun 19, 2002.

  1. js1257


    chas thats way funny
    #21     Jun 19, 2002
  2. thanks.
    #22     Jun 19, 2002
  3. This is interesting, since it appears by all that I read that the opposite is happening. Naz is going to NBBO, single prices, hoping to merge with Amex (doubtful, negotiations have been cut off), and bring everything back via Super Montage (acting more like the "scared animals" you refer to.....getting Isld and Inca and everyone suing them for monopolistic practices, etc.)....

    Anyway, lots of changes taking place....but I don't see the end of a fair and orderly "auction" marketplace in the near future.....but I've been wrong before.

    #23     Jun 20, 2002
  4. 'fair and orderly auction market' is a phrase that hardly describes the full reality of the system. Markets are only as 'fair and orderly' as the people whose practices make them up.

    Consider the headline on the front page right hand column of today's WSJ: "Why the Bad Guys of the Boardroom Emerged En Masse." Praytell, if they emerged en masse from the boardroom, is middle management exempt? And if they emerged en masse on Main Street, is Wall Street exempt? And, if they emerged en masse on one side of the 'Chinese Wall,' is the other side pure? And, if they emerged en masse upstairs, is the floor exempt? (and, tangentially, if they emerge en masse in the private sector, is the command sector exempt?)

    In the days of Beaver Cleaver, the specialist system was, I'd guess, much closer to it's ideal. These days, we live in a different world.
    #24     Jun 20, 2002
  5. It is not possible that the specialist is trading for his own account. However, his buddy the $2 broker could have an order "in the crowd" that the specialist is representing and you "matched and lost". I've been told that. I was on "parity" but because the order was small, they didn't break it up, flipped a coin and my order lost. This happened 5 times in a row once. What are the odds of that? The one thing you have going for you on the NYSE is that you won't get printed through.
    #25     Jun 20, 2002
  6. "fair and Orderly" is the key phrase. Does it get any more vague than that? But, what is fair? Fair to whom? Should the specialist be required to lose money in order to support a stock? Depends on a lot of things.... If he buys 500 shares every 25 cents on the way down is that fair and orderly if the stock drops 3 points? If you (and any other prop trader) are part of a broker/dealer is he required to give you the same market he should give to us customers? Your orders are marked as Principle not as Agent. Maybe that makes a difference...maybe...well....Anyway, as he sees it your order is no different than one from Goldman Sachs if you are trading for the firm account of a broker/dealer. Truthfully, I notice no different treatment now that I am a customer and not a prop b/d, but I am hoping if I really need it one day in an arbitration or something that I am higher moral ground as a customer than as a competing securities firm. I know, I know it probably isn't worth a hill of beans, but let me have my fantasy while I can.
    #26     Jun 20, 2002
  7. won't get 'printed through?'

    "buying every 25 cents on the way down" is a myth. You really should do your homework. And after you've executed 10000 transaction through a specialist, come back and post your observations to this thread.
    #27     Jun 20, 2002
  8. = cannot trade below your bid or above your offer...

    #28     Jun 20, 2002
  9. Im incredulous. You think because they say it isn't supposed to happen, that it doesn't? How many times must I post the article that documents hundreds of cases of 'trade through?"

    It happens.

    I'll post it again in a few minutes.
    #29     Jun 20, 2002
  10. xtrader


    the garbage...

    If you can't trade with the crooks, then quit.

    Noone said swimming with the sharks would be easy, stop crying.
    #30     Jun 20, 2002