Is Credit Spread really profitable?

Discussion in 'Options' started by cmukesh19, Aug 20, 2019.

  1. drmark27

    drmark27

    Those last two sentences are woefully incomplete.

    Maybe you can't make any money, either, if you "manage risk like a beast." A statement like that needs supporting evidence to be convincing.

    WRT "awareness," it's often an illusion. I'll assume you're referring to risk and then reference my last paragraph.
     
    #41     Aug 23, 2019
    BlueWaterSailor likes this.
  2. I'm not particularly interested in critiquing someone's writing style here - it's essentially irrelevant to the information being conveyed - but the problem with that post is that it conveyed essentially no information. How does a beast manage risk (fight-or-flight, perhaps)? How do hawks measure kurtosis and skew (and are these actually measured or evaluated?)

    Frankly, that gnomic pronouncement coupled with a vision of a statistically-inclined zoo did nothing for me, and I doubt that it did anything useful for anyone else.
     
    #42     Aug 23, 2019
    Baozi likes this.
  3. ffs1001

    ffs1001

    The markets have fallen today due to a few tweets from the President; volumes were light; VIX has risen to over 20. It feels like we've been here before - just a few days ago in fact.

    Does this make for a good opportunity to sell credit spreads? Iron Condors perhaps? Yep, I feel so.

    I'll be putting on this trade soon.
     
    #43     Aug 23, 2019
  4. You might want to review the IC I just documented in my journal. It's a little odd - a 0-day, low-delta SPY trade - but still worth looking at for the lessons it contains in this environment.
     
    #44     Aug 23, 2019
  5. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. You know what I meant. Of course if you manage early all the time you'll never profit and not even break-even, the point is if you scale positions you'll be ok. Follow your R:R and keep the system running.

    Awareness is not an illusion. If I'm aware of the -corr between Boeing and the Diamonds I can bank a coin. But if you arent aware you could never bank that same coin. You can always refer any concept in trading back down to risk.
     
    #45     Aug 24, 2019
  6. Baozi

    Baozi

    This sentence made my day :D

    I think that what he meant was:

    1- measure the parameters of the underlying distribution every day on multiple lookback periods.

    2- use the resulting distribution parameters to determine the expectancy of your spread.

    3- sell only the spreads with the highest (positive) expectancy, close a spread when expectancy becomes negative

    4- take a maximum risk equal only to a small % of your trading capital
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
    #46     Aug 24, 2019
    Philo Judeaus likes this.
  7. Stops don't work very well with options in my experience. They move too much, get triggered really easily without need, so you have to put in so much slack that it's not worth the approach. IMO, the whole point of the credit spread is that the risk management is built right into the trade structure itself.
     
    #47     Aug 24, 2019
    qlai and Wheezooo like this.
  8. @Baozi - it's always possible to come up with an interpretation that gives the greatest latitude, infinite benefit of the doubt, and adds depth an complexity where none exists. Religious apologists are quite facile with that process, for example.

    But this does not and cannot improve the quality of what is written. The only thing it does is cast doubt on the motives of the interpreter.

    The thing to do here is ask yourself: would the post have conveyed any shade of that to someone who is new and trying to learn? You know the answer to that as well as I do.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
    #48     Aug 24, 2019
  9. You may have missed the "most basic" qualifier in what I wrote. Please review it; it really is the key to understanding the entire phrase.

    1) Stops don't "move too much"; they're fixed.
    2) If yours "get triggered really easily without need", then you're using them incorrectly.
    3) There are trades in which they're appropriate, and other trades in which they're not. Low-ratio spreads are an example of the latter; TA-based day trades in stock would be an example of the former.

    It's foolish to dismiss something you don't understand, or to claim that it's useless because your experience or use case is inapplicable.
     
    #49     Aug 24, 2019
  10. qlai

    qlai

    I can't figure this one out ... You know you are picking pennies in front of a steamroller, so the answer is to trade small. How small to make it meaningful though? I just can't understand why retail trader would play this game with personal funds without any possibility to scale? I'm getting a feeling many people simply find it intellectually challenging. But I guess nothing wrong with learning new things, should pay benefits sooner or later.
     
    #50     Aug 24, 2019
    Epicurus likes this.