That's wonderful. Nuff respect to the folks who serve. Multiple members of my family have served, in the US military and in other country's forces. I am a strong believer in national security. Strong borders. There is no reason why we can't protect our borders without destroying the liberties of the people within them. That's what's happening right now. The borders are NOT being secured. The military is weak, mismanaged, FUBAR. We can't even secure a fucking city from natural disaster that we knew about a week in advance. It's a sad state of affairs. Pre-emptive war is nonsense, especially for a superpower like the US. It's a road to disaster. It's been the road to disaster for ALL superpowers for millenia. It happens again and again. War is not a necessity, especially with countries like Iran, a fuckin bootstrap with an armed forces that could be obliterated by Israel in 3 fuckin days. Diplomacy is necessity. Marque and reprisal - DEFINITELY. Are there thugs and scum and tiiiiiiiirorists out there? Sure. Kill them all...but you do it via M&R and don't put 200,000 troops in harms way, kill hundreds of thousands of innocent raggers, alienate the world, all in the name of 'protecting our freedom'. Bush is a fucking pawn, in the big game of war, politics, and big business. His administration has trashed the Constitution via hateful partisanship, lies, and damn lies.
Sounds like we have some thoughts in common. I guess I've just seen so many raving nutbag left-wing apologist idiots on this site (LoZZZer, where have you been lately?) that when I see two guys who seems to love the West and hate the fanatics who would rob us of our freedoms and remake the world according to their 12th-century worldview, I fee like we have more in common with each other than not and that we should spend our time slamming the PC apologist conspiracy-theory moonbats who spend half their lives on here spouting crapola. Among Americans, they are the ones who represent a real threat. I'd rather see you shouting down the people who think that 9/11 was a Bush family operation and that the towers were brought down by Laura Bush and her daughters, circling in black helicopters.
True... but we don't have to have things in common to have a debate... And my thoughts about 9/11 are as uncertain as the next guy. The simple timeline is '17 thugs flew planes into buildings'. But that's a story for another night. Lets be realistic though... How could 100,000 nutbars Muslim Jihadist Islamofascists, or lets just give them a boost, say a million, give or take a few hundred thousand, REMAKE THE WORLD?? Let's think logically about that... It can't happen. These disgusting Arab (and other) cocksuckers can't dig the sand out of the crack of their asses, let alone TAKE OVER THE WORLD... That's just not something I fear... BUT Our security is jeopordized every day, EVERY FUCKING DAY, with the current policy. The more wars we get into, the more pre-emption we take, the further our empire expands....the closer we are to our own self-annihilation.
My only comment would be that a couple hundred of them succeeded in changing the world pretty significantly. Changed my outlook, that's for fucking sure.
Exactly. I think we've got the established bad guys under pretty good surveillance. It's the stuff that gets routed this way and that through Europe or elsewhere that worries me. I know nuke stuff gives off a signature, but what about a container lined with lead or whatever can mask radiation? Scary stuff indeed. Of course, the moonbats sleep soundly "knowing" Al Qaeda would never, ever consider doing such a dastardly deed. But Bush? Most definitely, and to his own people.
Aloha, Nik. I was just up in your neck of the woods recently visiting friends (Kelowna. Okay, not exactly your neighborhood...!!). It was very interesting to me to hear the widespread support Obama has among your fellow Canadians.... Anyway, Monsieur Pooh said Bush scares him more than the Iranians on the basis that Bush can do something catastrophic while the Iranians cannot. Last time I checked, the Iranians in power are radical Islamists. You know, the charming mullahs who condone stoning kids to death for making out, etc. Perhaps you can find some redeeming qualities about M. Pooh. I'm too tired of arguing with his ilk nowadays so I've put him on Ignore, although I must admit he does show faint glimpses of normalcy in his thinking (i.e. respect for veterans, a recognition that at least there are those who want to destroy the US). Peace, H
Golly, wow, Hap has converted some non-beleivers, well done hap. Now, to convert the rest, who DONT think, given islam , being the second largest religion on the planet, ISN'T a diabolical threat , especially given, nobody who invaded a muslim country has ever actually won, how, precisely, this supposed threat of nutters should be "managed' in light of the reality, that for example, the 'fort america" in iraq , WONT be abandoned within a year or two can be managed, how , exactly, the middle east "problem" wont be solved, ever, hey, i'm all ears. Im not seeing solutions, Mr Hapaboy, im seeing exponential shit, caused directly by half witted policy.
You could sail a ship to 100 miles off US waters, then send 50 or 100 unmanned small planes carrying NBC shit over US airspace. There is no way they would all get identified, let alone shot down, in time. No need to go all the way to a port. Let's face it, a properly defended country would not have let 9/11 happen. Even without warnings, it is obvious that hijacking a plane and suicide bombing it into a building is feasible. The 9/11 towers and other tall buildings didn't even have (and most still don't have) any emergency mass evacuation procedures like parachutes, long rope-ladders etc to allow people to escape. People are crap at judging and avoiding risk, that's why good traders make money. No country in human history has ever been adequately defended nor will one ever be. It's just human nature for societies to be lazy, complacent, and unimaginative.
Americas business is War. Its been that way since the 60's. This is how special interests get rich, Government grows its power, and American hegemony thrives. Politics of Fear. The CIA admitted they grossly overestimated the Soviet threat. The second string Team B'ers, even more so. The Gulf of Tonkin never happened. The War on Drugs is a joke - our Government ships in the Drugs. Gulf War 1 - the Hitleresque infanticide fable, never happened. Saddam was reassured days before the invasion we wouldn't interfere in the Kuwaiti border dispute. Don't worry, we just want peace and friendship.... Milosevic was painted as the Balkans Hitler. Genocide not seen since the "Holocaust". MILLIONS DEAD. Never happened. Total lie. Al Queda - the name of a CIA computer database that stored names of Mujahadeen fighters recruited by America to fight the Soviets. The Ghastly Taliban - CIA funded and American allies right up 'til 911. Saddam Bin Osama - brimming WMD's ready to fire on allies within minutes. Dangerous alliances with Al Queda. Mobile weapon labs, hundreds of tons of Niger yellow cake . On and on. Total Bullshit. But this time, with the help of Neocons who funneled Iraqi Intel through their newly opened "Office of Special Plans" to make sure it was a passable fake (it wasn't). And finally, Iran. Amackdeenejad is going to Nuke us all to high heaven if we don't invade RIGHT NOW. Wheres the evidence on Iran? The NIE says they got nothing. Absolutely sweet fuck-all. And Bush claims they're wrong. Based on what? This is War Propoganda, Guy. Its as simple as that. Do real threats exists? Sure. Do radical Muslims plot harm against Americans? Absolutely. But NOWHERE near the scale, scope or reach our Government portrays these nomadic cave-dwellers to have. The huge glaring hole in your Neocon road show - CONSISTENCY. If any Neocon really believed Al Queda (or Saddam or Iran) was such a monumental threat to this Country, the borders would have been shut down Sept 12th, 2001. The ports would have seen TENS OF BILLIONS poured into rad and bio detection within months. Osama would be captured (not relegated to the memory hole). And that would be the end of it. The idea of securing the Homeland is a fairy tale. Pure fiction backed by nothing but hot air and bald, creepy looking dudes who want to eat your Rights for lunch. The War on Terror has nothing to do with keeping you or me safe. Its about Perpetual War, growing Government Power and enriching Lockheed and Exxon. As for the other stuff. You keep abreast of the towel heads. I keep abreast of the Government. Bush has given himself the authority to declare himself Dictator in the event of another attack. Laws are in place to round up citizens. Camps are being built. Posse Commentatus is toast. Habeus Corpus is gone. Citizens jailed indefinitely at the Presidents or "anyone of his designates" sole discretion. No jury. No lawyer. No nothing. Talks of rounding up the 5th Column (Constitutionalists and Militias). Homegrown Terror Legislation tabled outlawing any "radical views that incite hatred against THE GOVERNMENT". We're now told Al Queda has an army of white Caucasians numbering in the THOUSANDS, without a lick of proof. Thank you General Hayden. See where this is going? So when you say "who knows?" after the next attack, I say Bullshit. The writing is clearly on the wall. You're just in denial. And they won't come for you because you're one of them? You're not 'one of them'. They don't give two shits about you. See what happened in New Orleans? That wasn't a screw up. You might not be on the list of Dissenters - after all, you're a good Republican. But you're a nobody. Just like everybody else. If they do crackdown in Maui, and the Military happens to round up civilians to FEMA Camps, guess what? You're going whether you like it or not. Or two shots to the torso and one to the head when you resist. And then your kids get CPS'd, if and when they get out of FEMA camp. Thank Oddidoro for that. Will Gov attack us to invoke Martial Law? Yes. Bush, Hillary, McCain. Dont matter. 911 executed by criminal element in Bush Admin? Absolutely. Why? To create the catalyzing pearl harbor event PNAC called for to justify: limitless, sustained defense spending indefinite presence in the strategic middle east protect israel. grow government scope and power to ridiculous levels. They like to play God. And I haven't even touched the New World Order. Do yourself a favor, go read Carol Quigely. I'm not joking.
Let's look at the trend of nuclear weapons. In 1945 only 1 country had them. By 1960 it was 4 I think. By 1990 that was 7. Now it's in double figures. Clear extrapolation and common sense shows that eventually, any nation that wants to will be nuclear armed. Given the condition of many countries in the world, it will be child's play for non-state groups to eventually acquire nukes or to build them themselves. Maybe it will take 10 years, maybe 30, maybe 50, 100, 200 or 300. But eventually, the technology will be good enough that any well-funded group who wants to can get nukes. Strategic policy has to take account of this fact. Eventually your enemies will have nukes, which you can't defend against. The only way to avoid massive loss of life will be to not piss off anyone enough to want to nuke you. That means having a less aggressive foreign policy. It takes time to remove a belligerent reputation. Bush's actions in Iraq may have guaranteed that 50, 100 years from now the USA gets nuked by a terrorist group. Another implication of easy access to WMDs means that all extremist ideologies will be utterly destroyed. Religious fundamentalism is the prime culprit - all fundamentalists will eventually be "converted" or killed, because of the extreme security risk posed by nuclear armed nutters who think dying is a ticket to paradise. As an example, ask what would be a rational security policy if a nihilist sect had nukes and thought death was a way to the afterlife. Or some environmental nutters who thought mankind was evil and destroying the planet. IMO it is inevitable that extremists will be killed on detection, it will become a capital offence to believe certain extremist ideologies. Liberalism will disappear and people will be monitored in extremis in their daily lives.