IB is Refco 2.0!

Discussion in 'Stocks' started by bsparkyman, Jul 6, 2007.

  1. Has anyone suggested that HuggyBear Sterns might go bust. I mean, they showed such poor judgment in the sub prime mess, maybe there other nasties under the rug.

    You could make a negative case for many firms using the same logic.

    And refco was impossible to predict.
     
    #51     Jul 10, 2007
  2. TOM134

    TOM134

    1) nassau,

    I TOTALY agree with your analysis !!!!

    2) bpl1000,

    One guess as to how IB will make up the +$37M.

    You are correct = increase share price by increasing their customers' $ commisions.

    IB is one unreliable platform on which to trade!!

    Tom
     
    #52     Jul 10, 2007
  3. Who says they have to 'make it up' . It comes off the bottom line.

    When you do a lousy trade, which I'm sure never happens, how do you 'make it up'?
     
    #53     Jul 10, 2007
  4. mde2004

    mde2004

    No one on ET has a losing trade to speak of.
     
    #54     Jul 10, 2007
  5. timcar

    timcar

    In addition to avoiding shareholder lawsuits over this loss TP was embarrassed by his firm being scheme by these traders. Like one posters says TP wants to show confidence in his firm (IBKR).

    While this is embarrassing to (IBKR) that somehow traders were able to manipulate the system and cause the firm a loss,. at least this guy TP is attempting to acknowledge a problem has occurred and hopefully to correct it.

    Some CEO's might sweep this situation under a rug and try to act as if this was unimportant.
     
    #55     Jul 10, 2007
  6. From the reports, many market makers suffered losses in that affair. Bigger losses.

    The sharks spotted a flaw in the rules and ripped them a new one. Maybe two.

    If they can prove illegal manipulation (such as pre arranged trading where the seller agrees to dump shares at a stupid low price, as long as his 'buyer' catches them) then they may have to DISGORGE the gains.
     
    #56     Jul 10, 2007
  7. Enlightenment! You have snatched the pebble from my hand..
     
    #57     Jul 10, 2007
  8. Nassau,

    Refco made its money by fraudulently exposing its customers, investors, and creditors, as well as the larger financial system, to extreme risks. Refco collapsed when the extent of their schemes became sufficiently public, so that nobody was willing to trust them with the credit they needed in order to continue operating. This liquidity crisis put Refco out of business and left it unable to service its debts. This should answer your question as to how Refco went bankrupt.

    The fact that you didn't know this is only one more example, further demonstrating that you are speaking from ignorance.

    One of your previous posts, in this thread, stated that all listed companies, including IB, are fraudulent, and that as a result, IB will continue to have legal problems and its stock price will drop. You can't support your allegations of fraud againt IB, and so you are now backpedalling. You are now claiming that you didn't slander IB or make inflammatory statements about it. If you can't even accurately remember what you yourself wrote, only a few hours ago, then you are obviously unable to express worthwhile opinions about IB. I hope people will recognize this, so as to help minimize any harm which might result from the babblings emitted by you and others.
     
    #58     Jul 10, 2007
  9. nassau

    nassau

    yes indeed it is small, that is why the owner?? while still a public company anted up. I believe he owns / controls 80-85 percent of the shares similiar to corporations like Mittal Steel (MT) but I have done no dd to be able to say how accurate that is.
    but that is one of the main reasons for the quick influx / contribution of the funds..pay now pay later,
    a lot of the institution that run into similar issues are able to write it off or down the losses...have mergers which give again write offs, tax benefits etc.
    in reality it has nothing to do with share price..
    what has and does is one's perception of the stocks value...
    stock appreciation versus stock value equals a long or short position
    proof is a stock that has great earnings and retraces dollars for x no. of days before reversing sentiment.
    I can guarantee you that only the institutions know the hidden agenda while hedge funds / funds can alter the short term inertia of the stock the institutions in the long run dictate as we can never compete with their pb, the fact they are large majority share holders and in a lot of the cases are the underwritters and analysis on the stocks..either directly or indirectly.
    I/ we past or present owners of refco had no idea nor the ability to discern the out come..thus I do have losing traders and refco is obviously not my first over the last 20 plus years.

    I personal believe the small float is one ways the owner ensured IB was safe? for total manipulation which imo was very smart.
    If I were to trader IB stock in the present circumstances I would trade it by witting of put options and buying out of the money calls.
    last, over the last few years I have been a victim of several such occurrences and are part of ? civil litigation - refco and several of the stocks related to back dating of options and as of today only the lawyers are winning.
    Patience here will give one a good buying opportunity, the hard part is we are in uncharted waters and as supports and resistances are only one's perception and IB we are guessing where some support ? is. imo IB is not a short term trade but a yrs. trade.

    w
     
    #59     Jul 10, 2007
  10. nassau

    nassau

    You obviously must of had a hard time with English.

    Please go back, print each of my posts, take your time and compare. Use some crayons to underline and high lite for ease. NO where did I say all listed companies, including IB, are fraudulent, and that as a result, IB will continue to have legal problems and its stock price will drop! that is your interpretation and not what I said.

    Everything you state about refco is hindsight.
    If everyone knew what you are now stating do you think they would of been the largest and so successful. Do you think anyone would of underwrote the IPO and had institutional share participation etc etc
    The 500 million made no difference to the day to day operations thus the reason it ran for so many years per IPO.
    I agree once the shit hit the fan refco lost credibility but that was also fed by the media and the institutions who benefited while private shareholders lost. The stock had a 10 day moratorium place on it to only start trading 2-3 days later to be halted on a rally.?? long enough for a lot of the big boys to clean up. I have never seen where a stock was halted then allowed to trade and halted on a rally? total bs
    I am not aware of one of the stock involved in backdating of options or that is/was out of nasdaq compliance delisted? why, not profitable.
    There was no reason for us shareholders to lose funds the way we did but again that is my personal opinion and like you I am untitled to it.

    I am very careful how and what I say unlike you.

    I said and am saying we as traders have frauds committed on us daily by the corporations, brokers/banks etc
    god man read or listen to the news, back dating of options, accounting errors, enron,refco, analysis updating or downgrades with no accountability or fiduciary responsibility etc.
    I am guessing by your posts I am a lot older than you.
    You know the definition of business...
    being able to exact money from a man's pockets without resorting to violence.
    that's what banks,brokers,insurance companies, mm, nyse specialist, slippage, gaps, and the corporate stocks we trade do to us. exact our funds with us having no recourse.

    Do you actually even trade?
    god help your mentor(s) if you have any.

    w
     
    #60     Jul 10, 2007