I want to build a group of guys around your system.

Discussion in 'Trading' started by microjohn, May 18, 2005.

  1. I posted here the other day, but many of the replies that I got, while helpful, were not exactly what we need right now. Much of this is due to my vagueness...

    We would like to rapidly expand a group of traders around a very rigid system, one where discretion is not allowed.

    For example: "When X happens, you buy. You then offer at Y and Z. When A happens, you sell. You then cover at B and C."

    Many of you will think that this is ridiculous...if such a system existed, why would it be for sale? If it worked the creator would be rich. However, we do not need the system to be ultra-profitable. We would be happy with 20+ guys making 200-300 net a day. I think that something like this may exist that's been treated as a throw-away by someone because of the low numbers.

    I also think there could be other sellers:

    1) Not every trader likes trading. The stress does knock out lots of guys every day. If you had a good system, but wanted to retire, why not let it continue to work for you, stress free?

    2) Some traders are afraid of big size. They work great with 5 lots, but 10 lots or bigger scare the crap out of them. This is a risk free way for them to capitalize on their potential.

    3) Students. There are probably thousands of kids around the globe developing trading systems for class projects. Say one works...but it's not the golden ticket. It only makes about $500 a day. Decent money, but he'd rather try again for the big score. Why not sell this idea to someone who actually wants it? Someone with time and capital to cultivate it?

    4) Some people lack capital and connections. What about kids in India and China? There are plenty of kids there that have more education that you and I combined, but no access to utilizing their skills.

    5) A good trader with no connections. Maybe he trades from home, and he is profitable. He might not know until he sees this post that he could be much more profitable for no more work.

    There are probably other possible sellers, but these seem to me to have the best potential.

    We think that 10% of the trader's net is fair pay for this, since we have to pay the trader 70%. That gives one third of the rewards to the originator of the idea, and we keep the other two thirds. Your only work ever would be to teach me how to trade your system. Once it works, I will teach everyone else. After that, you will only hear from us monthly on pay day. Of course, we are willing to sign all of the appropriate legal paperwork to ensure security in our transaction.

    Please let me know if you have something like this, or if you know anyone that does.


  2. Why would those kind of guys need YOU?
    :D :D :D :D
  3. Htrader

    Htrader Guest


    And furthermore, how would the seller be sure that they are actually receiving 10% of the total profits? Unless you disclose your entire trading log, the seller would just have to take your word on it.

    The only replies you receive will most likely be from other scammers. How fitting.
  4. hjay23



    A pretty good idea. Really boils down "the 'get rich quick by finding a kick-ass non-discretionary system' to trade for nothing" business model down to a tight little internet post. Bold. Quick & Daring. Impresive!

    Could I venture a guess that you come from an internet marketing, or publishing or some other type of advertising taxonomy background? May i also venture you are quite successful at it?

    If this person, Indian, Chinese or Western, or someone affiliated with this wunderkind, were in fact reading this on ET, they would automatically be, well, 'well connected'. That is one of the cool things about ET. Unless their English is really really bad. so bad, they do not attempt communicating.

    Also, In regards to non-discretionary systems that make money. Now I don't know that much, but from what I' heard that's REAL REAL HARD!

    If you've got the brains and/or experience to come up with one of those, (e.g. Keith Fitschen, John Ehlers, Ricky Cheung, Lee Gettess, Charles LeBeau, Randy Sarrow, Welles Wilder, Larry Williams ) then you've probably got the wherewithal to come up with a decent business plan to attract some venture capital.

    But that's just me wanting to play devil's advocate. I'm impressed with your panache. If you find something good, let me help you trade the sh*t out of it!

    Actually I think your logic is quite good. Odds are that there are well over 100+ people in China alone with successful non-discretionary trading systems! 99 if you don't count Ricky Cheung.
  5. It's not that bad, but if he is looking for an ATM machine then you are right. A good non-discretionary system can make you money almost week in week out, but obviously not every day... And a weak month can happen from time to time too...
  6. lescor


    Maybe he's looking for something that a group of guys can churn shares on daily and provide him with some nice commission overrides. The system only has to produce enough green to keep them coming in each day.

    Simple plan really.
  7. Thank you lescor.

    Like I said, I'm not looking for the golden ticket. Obviously, that's not for sale.

    Seing the kids come in and out of the door for years now as a trader myself, I know for a FACT that $250/day is plenty to keep them in their seats.

    I now have some very ambitious partners, and we're just hoping to find a simple system that 20-50 guys can trade profitably. And, of course we're willing to pay for it.

    I realized tonight that there's another class of seller that potentially is the biggest group:

    Traders that are currently trading a system that they were taught. These guys like trading, but are interested in making extra cash for nothing (your ATM), as we all are.

    There are groups all over the country teaching new traders gimmicks, edges, and tricks that consistently make small scalped profits. I'm just looking to buy access to them.

    As to hjay23...thanks, but my only work history is financial services and trading.
  8. No one would sell a non discretionary system that could make 20 - 50 guys $250 each per day because the system could actually make $5,000 to $12,500 per day if traded by one person.

    If it's non discretionary, then you could simply program a computer to execute it, so you don't actually need 20 - 50 guys to help you execute it.

    On the other hand, I could see someone selling a more discretionary system that could make $250 per person per day if the system is manpower intensive.

    For example, if the system requires watching stocks almost tick by tick, then a trader will be limited to only watching a few stocks, even if the system could work in many other stocks. In that case, I could see someone selling the system.
  9. vlad



    well implemented and tested automated trading system (not discretionary system) for one market segment will cost approximately from minimum side: 2 persons x 2 years x $150.000 = $600.000. Hardly any serious developer will sell it to you for 10% with a full disclosure. Very possible, you will have only crumbs from the table. So, be careful. Probability that some talented kid will develop and test such kind of system ~ 0.0001%, need a lot of routine work, kids don’t like it.
  10. MAD10


    microjohn, I've got the system for you.
    You are going to need about 2.7 million dollars per trader and I guarantee you $250-300/day. (I keep 10%)
    Alternatively, you need 1/2 mil per trader, lock-up your $$ for 12 months, and average $300/day, no guarantee (and I keep 20%).
    Last but not least, you set me up with $200K per (imaginary) trader, lock up your dough for 36 months and I guarantee you (yes) $300/month/trader (and YOU get 50%)
    i.e. you and your partners need to specify in some more reasonable detail what kind of performance you expect. $$/day is garbage.
    #10     May 18, 2005