Huh there are two distinct type of citizenship in the USA ?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by harrytrader, Jun 28, 2003.

  1. I read this in a newsletter did someone ever heard about that ?!

    "Dear John,
    First of all, I want to thank you for your excellent newsletter and the comments from your readers. I live in Canada, but I know as a fact that there are two distinct type of citizenship in the USA.
    1. US Citizen - - If you are a US Citizen, then you have to file an income tax report to the IRS whatever you live in the USA or not. By the law, you cannot hide any income because you are implicitly an employee of the "US Government Corporation". Being a US Citizen is a voluntary act by requesting a social security number (SSN), and from this contract, you have to report your income. The IRS is not constitutional; however having a SSN is YOUR contract with the IRS to receive benefits (social security, pension, health, education, etc) in exchange of a portion of your income. Under these rules, you cannot have an offshore account and hide part of your income, because it is against "your contract" with the IRS. The IRS uses the same law as you and I. We could have a contract, and if one party fails to respect its part, then the other party can sue the faulty party. An audit done by the IRS is the same as your employer entering into your cubical looking for a document. Your employer does not need your permission to enter in 'your' cubicle/office. If you use your employer's equipment (say a computer, email, printer, telephone) for personal use, be careful; your employer has the legitimate right to record everything and use it against you if necessary. You have the permission to use the equipment; not the right to use it. If you have an SSN, you are an employee of the "US Government Corporation" with the permission to work for another company or work as a contractor, but ultimately the IRS has every rights to know about your income, where you live, what you do, etc.
    2. American National - - This is a free human being, having the right to to business with anyone without the approval or the obligation to report to any third party (e.g. IRS). As an American National, you get a DIFFERENT passport than a US Citizen, and you are free to travel anywhere you want. You don't have to file any income tax and you have far more rights, including heritage without taxes.
    To return as an American National status and free yourself from the IRS slavery, you have to do the following: Return your Social Security Number (SSN) to the IRS (there is no official form for this, but you write them a letter). Never use or ask for government services. Return your state's driver license. Having a state's driver license implicitly implies you are a US Citizen. Have an international driver license instead. Don't use a zip code in your postal address. Zip codes are internally used by the US Government Corporation to designate US Citizen. When you enter your zip code, always place in parentheses () so it cannot be use legally as a proof of your US Citizenship. You don't have to live outside the USA to be an American National. It is important to notify the IRS to withdraw your SSN. Your SSN is a life contract and leaving to another country does not void your contract with the IRS. Of course the IRS will lie about the fact you can withdraw your SSN, but once you have written the letter, they cannot legally go against you for not filing a tax return. However, you still have to pay the IRS any money you owe them until the contract was voided. You don't have to hide from the IRS because you are not paying income tax. As a free sovereign American Citizen the IRS rules and regulations don't apply to you! "
  2. It seems impossible to find official source since the official source has been obfuscated :D

    Our website focuses heavily on the citizenship issues. In doing so, we included several links to the Social Security Administration (SSA) Program Operations Manual System (POMS) website found at:

    In particular, we refer frequently to section RS 00204.015, which is entitled "Developing Evidence of U.S. Citizenship". The link to that page is at:

    Starting on January 27, 2003, this page was deleted and now we get a blank display. Furthermore, the feedback comments page on the website was also disabled at that time. Apparently, the government doesn't want to hear complaints about the removal of that page. It also appears that they don't want to have to answer the numerous questions about citizenship that will occur because they deleted information about that subject from their website.
  3. bobcathy1

    bobcathy1 Guest

    Sadly Harry, this is not true. I think it was a scheme to get out of paying taxes to the IRS.

    However, you can have a US passport and be a citizen of another country...dual citizenship. And you pay taxes to the country you live in.
  4. This is up there with the $600 cookie recipe and Bill Gates paying you money to forward e-mails.

    Harry, just because you read something (especially on the internet) doesn't make it true. I know you know this.

    "the US Government Corporation" .... Now THAT"S FUNNY!!! Can't you sense a hoax when it is so obvious?? Maybe it really isn't that obvious if you have not lived in the US. Putting a parentheses around your zip code? This stuff is really off the wall.

    While it very clearly was written for laughs, it is quite interesting to see that a non US citizen can believe it to be possible.

  5. Is there a procedure to renounce your US Citizenship? Could I write the INS and tell them I do not wish to be a US Citizen anymore?
  6. ttrader


    I think, it is true ...

  7. Harry - having US citizenship has nothing to do with having a SSN. You don't become a US citizen BECAUSE you have an SSN. Just ask those born in the US of non-US citizens - they automatically have US citizenship. Not because they got an SSN, but because they were born here.
  8. You can get yourself convicted of a felony. That will deprive you of your right to vote, and several other freedoms that usually come along with citizenship.

    unfortunately, even as an ex-con, you will still have to pay your taxes if you can earn earn an income. They even try and collect income taxes on illegally obtained income.

    You can certainly "defect" and renounce your citizenship, if you choose to. But again, if you step foot on American soil, you will be held responsible for any taxes you may owe whether or not you joined the North Korean Army or Al Qaeda. Or just go for wearing a grass skirt in Tahiti. And of course, you will also be accountable for any acts of sedition or treason if applicable. You will NOT get diplomatic immunity if you get a job with the Syrian government and come to visit your family in Baltimore (or wherever they are).

    However, you may leave the US, and stay abroad virtually indefinitely under some conditions. Depending on circumstances, you may be able to avoid paying American taxes on money earned outside the US. But now always. Ever heard of a W8?

    Of course, the easy way to not pay taxes is to just hook up with some survivalist cult in Idaho, declare "war" on America, and take your chances being David vs. Goliath.

    Good luck no matter how you evade taxes. But aphie, for a guy like you, with a sense of justice and a strong belief in right and does driving on roads, crossing bridges, using sewer systems and water treatment plants paid for by other peoples taxes sit with you? What about going to a hospital built with municipal bonds? Do you ever go on airplanes? The air traffic controllers who keep you alive are paid with tax money. The police that keep you safe from less honorable people than yourself, same thing.

    If you want to renounce your citizenship to avoid taxes, that is not going to work. If you want to renounce you citizenship for political reasons, I would be interested to know where you intend to go:confused:

    Keep us "posted" (pardon the pun).

  9. ttrader


    trong: There is no relation between tax payments and using of not-thought-over expenditure ! (do i pay for sco buildi ngs when using unix software? of coures no ...)

  10. Huh?

    #10     Jun 29, 2003