IluvVol, Your comments are kind and understood. I will respond to your questions after these 2 comments about the purpose of the thread and clarification of the reason for limiting the answering of questions. For everyone, please understand that I'm so busy actually working on the strategy itself that plays another part of avoid going into great detail and answering lots of questions. I don't have time with a family, full time job, and working nights and weekends on this strategy to also take much time to teach. I would LOVE to have the time as Jack does to educate others without charge. My goal in this thread was to learn primarily and whatever anyone else picked up at the same time was great since Jack seems to prefer the public forum for answering questions. It was may thought that going to through the entire steps of SCT with Jack would open further enlightenment to refine my systems. I already had developed the dom and smart money stuff but had decided to back up and "start from the beginning" to make sure I didn't miss anything important. What I learned primarily from this exercise was the understanding of what I call timing and also what Jack calls "pace". That's the essence of why he teaches the channels so us mortals can "see" the timing and pace from the P,V relationship. Okay to answer your questions. I was encouraging that a successful auto trading of the SCT in particular is possible. Many comments on ET stated it was impossible, too vague, etc. But I was intrigued to try. NOTE: Jack or Spyder might say what I'm doing is not exactly SCT. That's fine. I have always been forced to "re-engineer" manual processes in the course of automating them. It's the end result that matters. Sure that's easy to answer at a high level. There is detail Level II DOM data available to retail. I use MB Trading and haven't tried others. But I figured out a way through rigorous study and trial and error to get the information I needs as an "extrapolation" of the Level II data. So, as Jack says, it synthetic or artificially generated. Also, I noticed that it's obvious that most of the DOM traders are computerized with millisecond response times which servers to hide most of trail to human traders who can't process the DOM that quickly. I understand your concerns. And there are numerous details I don't wish to take time to support or "defend" due to my busy schedule. For example, in fairness, the chart I showed has 100 tick data but the smart money volume indicator using volume over time and the 2 charts are synchronized. Additionally, I have other indicators not shown like the dumb money indicator also. On occasion they trade in large enough volume (usually panic or stops) to move the market. I have several indicators I developed by condensing and converting DOM/Level II data to see it from different angles. 2 of those, are used in this strategy. I'm still working on how to use the others. My ideas on automating the timing of the market is evolving and changing rapidly. One small advantage to autotrading is that my system spending the time and, well, energy of trading so I can spend my time and energy on research and development to improve it. NOTE: In the equities or futures market, you don't need to jump all those hoops to get smart and dumb money information. You have T&S as well as DOM. But in Forex, you have to get creative. It seems traders always hold something back from what they teach. Even Jack talks about indicators he uses that I never saw in any of his charts online. So I have been left to develop them myself using my imagination and trading knowledge, etc. I'm very interested to hear any reasonable argument why I should spend time at this stage in my life freely teaching everything I know and worked very hard to learn. I don't mean it sarcastically. But I sincerely don't understand that. When I post on ET to ask questions, I always post saying something like, "I don't expect you to give away and secretes or spell it out for me. Just kindly point me in the right direction." That leaves a reasonable "barrier of entry" for people willing to do the work to figure it out as the rest of us have. As you see, I have a little more specific idea where to get the information but the details you and other readers need to work out for yourselves. Is that fair? NOTE: If anyone doesn't believe me. That's fine. And maybe even good. You're welcome to do as you please in that sense. I'm not out to prove anything. I'm only out to profit from this ATS, and that, as quickly as possible. These are broad concepts already covered elsewhere on ET except for the specific point that I feel the SCT in particular can be automated. I think the trades on the chart show the effectiveness at least on that particular day. Sincerely, Wayne
Jack, I will be eternally grateful to you for what you shared. Especially, for your kindness in taking the initiative to PM me to answer my questions on another thread. I would be very happy to answer your questions especially since I know you would understand instantly without long explanations. Still, it has taken me many hours of research on your PM's and posts on ET to translate what you write to something I can understand. It would be a great honor to continue this thread, explain more detail about how this works and get your feedback on further ways to improve it. Still, in this post, yet again, you use new terms that I haven't learned yet and acronyms I never heard of. ( I did look up verniers.) In short, it comes across as gibberish (just like every other one you write till I take the hours of time to research terms and acronyms to grasp your point.) I'm worn out from that effort since I have a sufficiently working system based on SCT and now have logistical work to fine tune it and get it deployed to run in the simulated environment this week. I have your information online printed and in a 3 ring binder and continue to re-read it. Plus, I can continue to learn over time and with experience. In summary, you're a genius, Jack. And I additionally respect your age and seniority and experience. But if you really need to condescend to explain things and ask questions using everyday words or at least include a glossary or parenthetical means of acronyms and Hershey jargon. I, for one, will be an avid learner if you do so. Folks, there's no end what we can learn from this man if he would put more effort into clarifying his writing and lift the burden a little from his students. I'm sure that I'm barking up the wrong tree on that point. Okay, back to work on my ATS automated timing algorithm. Sincerely, Wayne
I have taken the same trek... http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...spective+draw+channel*+visual+aid#post1589621
This being my last post in this thread, let me say this at least: 1) You say you dont have time for your family because of....you dont actually explain (as many other things which you fail to make clear in this thread).....so.....my question is.....why do you waste OUR time? On 26 pages you dont give out any details of your trading method WHATSOEVER. Wy do you waste our time then? I dont think anyone wants to read some human resource charts about "higher learning -> success -> quit -> advance to the next human stage" B/S. May sound harsh but would you waste your time reading someone`s comments saying "How to build xxx` and then all you read is about his grandma`s life??? If you cant precisely discuss your ideas then WHY DO YOU BOTHER? Why dont you simply work on your stuff and thats it? You dont seem to be in need of any suggestions for improvement. And you point out you dont want to give things away for free ..so...again....why you bother wasting yours and others time? 2) You talk about forex volume and your comments below are VERY misleading to say the least. Looking at MB trading`s volume will GUARANTEED NOT give you any idea of the depth of the fx market. Especially will it not give you any hunch of where deep-pockets are headed nor the size of the aggregate market. There is NO WAY to extrapolate the whole market by simply looking at one fx brokers volume. Let me tell you why: MB Trading connects to an ECN that is more frequented by small hedgefunds and retail people. THe big guys all trade through large sell-side OTC brokers or EBS. Markets are dynamic, meaning, retail and small hedgefund flow may completely dry up and yet the big players may all be in the game which you would with your `extrapolation` not grasp at all. Your idea of using fx volume data for your trading system must fail miserable or it may actually not have any impact whatsoever so that you can safely cut it out. 3) You often say `its easy to answer on a high level`. Have you actually noticed that most people asked you to explain things on a low level, on a level even a kid can understand? I believe that people who really understand what they are doing, and who do something that really works, AND if they want others to learn it as well, THEN they can explain it in very FEW and SIMPLE words. You fail to do that to say the very least. So, one of the above conditions is probably not met, which means, why do you keep posting? I have a simple answer (and I never read any of this Hershey dude`s comments to get to this conclusion): YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO SELL. GREAT BUT THEN PLEASE POINT IT OUT FROM THE BEGINNING SO WE ALL KNOW CLEARLY. THANKS!!!
How about I agree to post every detail of how it works and share the source as soon as I have time? I will do so, okay? This wasn't a teaching thread. It should have been obvious from the first page that I was attempting to interview Jack and learn from him while building an ATS. He wasn't willing to cooperate in the way I wished in the end. I felt many of my posts exchanged with him were a waste of my time too. So I sympathize with you. My major benefits were learning a little more clearly about what Jack means by pace. And I actually did manually tape a chart and that opened an AH HA better understanding of stuff Jack writes elsewhere. It finally led me to decide it wasn't necessary for an ATS for SCT. Sorry, I will give out everything sometime when I have the time to document it, package it, and support it. Of course. Aren't you being a little silly? Everyone knows that Forex doesn't have any true volume. It's a distributed market and not an exchange like CME, etc. Are you sure? Have you tested those statements? Anyway, in the very big picture, you are partially correct. However, have YOU looked at the MB Trading DOM/Level II data? Have you compared it to market data over a period of time? Have you back tested? You can have all the theories you want. I test everything myself and find out what works. It does for me. So there' no need to discuss it further. I'm not going to make any effort to "prove" it. Even if I did, each reader would still have a to test to verify it anyway. I just notice your all caps below. I don't appreciate that because it appears like yelling. Well. Sorry you feel that way. I promise to share the details as soon as I have time. Cheers! Sincerely, Wayne
Folks, Thoughts I'd share a idea for a tool I'm using. Basically, in any undertaking it's important to have a goal, and endgame. So I'm using an indicator I call "Traversal" but it's based on a Zig Zag indicator. The major difference is eliminating the last leg that can change. So this indicator is useless for trading but invaluable for analysis. As you can see in the chart, it picks out all all the best highs/lows just like taping would do. (Click for larger view). <img src="http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=2081445" width="800" height="600"> I use it by telling me the total theoretical potential for the time period. For example for September 4, 2008, 8:15 to Noon, if someone could trade perfectly with the Zig Zig (using hindsight) they could make 529 pips. 529 pips in a range of less only 50 pips. That's 10 X the Range. This gives you an idea that if anywhere near that performance we could hit many multiples of the range. I'm working on using this indicator along with the smart money, dom, and others to forecast the timing of the market and come closer to ideal trades. Sincerely, Wayne
From Catch Up with Tomorrow's Paper Today <img src="http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=2009274">
and what is your point? To buy at the lowest point and sell at the highest? Hmm, you must be a wunderkind if you can accomplish such. Good luck!!!
Wayne, Thanks for your honest comments in your previous posts. Appreciate being straight and to the point in that one. I am just not sure where you try to get to in this thread. Could you please explain in a sentence or two. I guess we all know that we "could have" bought at the bottom and sold at the top but there is simply no way of telling which on is the top or bottom. Searching for this equates to searching for the holy grail which is simply unrealistic. So, whow does this chart help you in your analysis other than knowing the trading range? This you can accomplish in a number of ways: Garman-Klass intraday vol, ATR, realized vol, among many others. I use it for position sizing. But I dont think that was your point. Care to explain? Thanks