Holy Cr*p ISLD blocked from providing QQQ ,DIA, and SPY full book quotes

Discussion in 'Order Execution' started by stock777, Sep 20, 2002.

  1. You might want to not ask about "America" (this discussion belongs elsewhere, see Moderator's post above).

    But if you ask "What is happening to the index product market in America?", I think I can play devil's advocate once again (risking of course being called a traitor by those who prefer blindly following propaganda, wich is a more convenient lifestyle anyway).

    The advantage I saw trading SPY on ISLD as opposed to the eminis was that I would sometimes get a fill that was maybe .10 away from the market. When you think about that objectively, it is somewhat "unfair" to the party on the other side.

    What they are trying to do now is force the ISLD SPY traders to trade ES instead and the QQQ traders to trade NQ. While those wiggle around quite a lot, too, it's still not quite as dirty as some of those island fills.

    Think of it this way: Would you rather have them effectively shut down QQQ or NQ?
    #61     Sep 22, 2002
  2. well if it increases market depth in NQ, it's good, . I don't see your point regarding the conspiracy to draw traders to eminis though.
    More practically I don't really know what route to use now for the Q's, I 've always used ISLD and didn't even watch the NBBO. I hate to wait for a fill from the floor, especially with the Q's. Even on ISLD you can get a very bad fill on a 10-15 cent spike.
    #62     Sep 22, 2002
  3. May I ask why you prefer QQQ over NQ? I think that's what I'm missing and that's why I came up with my "conspiracy theory". To me, it looks like taking away fast executions from the QQQ would drive all the traders who rely on it to the eminis.
    #63     Sep 22, 2002
  4. I trade NQ and the Q's for overnights and when I don't feel confident enough to go with NQ (to play larger intraday moves: 15 min.+ holds) .
    #64     Sep 22, 2002
  5. horseman


    I am considering filing suit against the SEC under the Freedom of Information act to be allowed to see the Island quotes.
    #65     Sep 22, 2002
  6. www.island.com

    open up their javsa based browser

    that should let you see their quotes
    #66     Sep 22, 2002
  7. im not starting an argument, but what is dirty about an island fill if someone chooses to route an order there - at least they display depth (or a representative portion of it)? what is dirty, is a MM/specialist holding your order 'til the market moves farther against you. again, didn't island prove that there is no need for MM/specialist system? lets face it, anytime there is an order imbalance and trading halts, the specialists move the market so far that right away they make their money back and more. this is essentially what don brights open order strategy is all about. or am i wrong?
    #67     Sep 22, 2002
  8. jwcrim


    This is what I take from the announcements:

    1. SEC has disallowed the dissemination of any data by anybody doing 5% or more of the equity's trades, that would cross or lock any of the NMS markets. Island could still publish (display) those orders that don't lock or cross.

    2. Island is not a participant in the NMS (National Market System) but if it were to be, SEC would disallow any Island trades that that are outside the best prices of all the NMS exchanges taken together.

    For NMS members, SEC has recently softened on this rule by allowing trades that are outside the best prices of other exchanges by no more than 3 cents. So you can "trade-through" lock or cross within these limits but you still can't display any orders that would lock or cross.

    3. IB has assumed that Island data is (for its purposes) now unavailable. So IB won't display any data for Island nor will it Smart Route to Island. It will route your order there if you direct it, but you have to come up with your own price.

    4. So if Island refuses to join the NMS it can trade at any price but it can't display any locking or crossing orders.

    If Island joins the NMS, it will be restricted to a +/- 3 cent trade- through lock/cross limit but it still won't be able to display the corresponding orders. And I don't know if the customer would be able to flag an order to Island to be executed only at Island (at prices within these limits).

    Please feel free to correct any of this.
    #68     Sep 22, 2002

  9. jwcrim,

    Thanks for your post. It inspired me to ask Island in a mail why they dont display the relevant orderbooks except the locked and crossed orders. I will post their complete reply as soon as i recieve it.

    #69     Sep 23, 2002
  10. not only are there no quotes .... but they do not even give
    orderbook info now for the ETF's mentioned

    #70     Sep 23, 2002