So, how long does ET go before they drop the blinders and realize these two are the same people (as a handful of ETers have already figured out and are posting on this person's two thread), that Winborn has admitted he is a company, and they are here solely for future commercial purposes??? And that if you stuck them under journals where they belong, you would not be encouraging obvious spammers??? Quote from MarketException We have had 5 trades and one loss so far since I reported my system here. I have had excellent win rate and profit in this 5 trades. I agree that 5 trades is not enough to establish a high level of confidence in any system. But I invite to to stay tuned and just observe the performance. Don't listen to me or others just evaluate the signals for yourself. Same Person, Two Aliases: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=208459 http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=207377
I already know they are the same people and so does everybody else. I was enjoying watching this guy get roasted by other members to be honest with you.
to start with, both are idiots, crosspollinate, and are desparately seeking future income via some delusion that putting unproven track record posts will cause people to sign up... All the while thinking the site owners & members have no idea about this, as if they had never seen it before.
You are aware that Baron allows such and they know what's going on. I can go into in-depth details of a dozen such cases here at ET but I'll mentioned only one. Remember the PivotFarm.com folks ??? They came to ET with a FREE website and they started this thread @ http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=184810 via two user names ESResistance and PivotFarmer. Their website, blog, twitter account was all free during their brief stay here at ET...no fee base information at those locations. However, several members showed up at the above link and complained they were setting up shop for a future fee-base website via using ET high search engine ranking to help spread the word about themselves. Guess what, all of those complaint messages from the thread were DELETED by someone...leaving a nice clean looking PivotFarm thread. Later they PivotFarm folks stopped posting here and that's when they changed all the content at those free locations into fee-base after getting high search engine exposure off the back's of EliteTrader.com high search engine ranking. *** Now going forward with a new future vendor...Baron has openly stated that Winborn and MarketException are the same. Yet, he doesn't ban them nor delete their messages. *** Thus, it's allowed and if you don't like it...you aren't going to scare away those guys via acting like a troll. They remain because it helps keep ET looking active with you guys continuing revisiting their threads and posting messages. Simply, Baron is not stupid...he visions a possible future income sponsor source. It's kind'uv like the Puretick threads...folks bashed and mudslinged with them...giving them lots of exposure. However, as soon as folks stopped talking to them, stopped mentioning them, started putting them on ignore...they quietly disappeared for awhile (several weeks) until the same idiots decided to bash them again. Puretick returned from the grave and then became sponsors. Note: some members accused Baron and Joe in pretending to be new bashers in raising Puretick from the dead. Yeah, winborn is planning a future fee-base service and there's nothing wrong with that. There's also nothing wrong with vendors posting free content here at ET as long as they aren't advertising or mentioning their services. Baron and Joe has specifically stated such was OK. Heck, look at yourself, you were formerly known as TraderZones and rcanfiel. You directly advertised your 250k trading system without ET permission to ET members via those former user names and your not a sponsor. You did not get banned although your messages got deleted. Simply, just be happy you're still allowed to continue posting here under Baron's rules and maybe winborn will eventually become a sponsor like Puretick...allowing guys like you to continue being here considering ET is Baron income source via the sponsors. Now, the above explains why PivotFarm.com thread is still here after those guys went from FREE to FEE. I think Baron is hoping they eventually become sponsors and hoping winborn will someday become a sponsor too...more money in Baron's pocket. Mark
Good points. Baron is involved with so many conspiracies around here to include PivotFarmgate. Something is amiss. Maybe this site is not really to increase Baron's monetary pile, but a sick game of amusement where Baron pits one user against another. Good detective work!
In the same vein as you PLAY with people here, your 3-tiered high security firewalls to boot, and start seemingly harmless threads that eventually end up attacking mods, now you're taking on Baron? Goodluck. This is how Baron plays with/sees you ...... sung from YOUR perspective .... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-kjIfx1aQo (When you're sitting there in your silk upholstered chair Talking to some rich foks that you know I hope you won't see me in my ragged company ....)
You make some good points re the potential sponsor/income & the traffic generated by "bashers". Here are some facts: 1) as far as I'm aware nobody knows their real intentions. They could be setting up a nigerian scam via PM's they may receive from newbies with wire instructions to some african bank. We know how gullible some people are, so it wouldn't be that hard to steal a few Ks here and there. 2) regardless of their real intentions, their approach is extremly dishonest. They have ignored all embarrassing questions, only replied to the ones they liked. They tried to fool people into believing their actions are motived by pure generosity and religion. 3) in multiple occasions they have been caught cheating, lying about unprobable fills or even better with a stop that was not triggered. 4) they use at least one alias (maybe more?) as a shill - and frankly a stupid one - who got caught lying : the Princeton big IQ "seasoned" trader who fell by accident on the thread and claims he started trading the signals with real money and is very happy, etc.. I could go on and on, but I'll go straight to the point. Whatever these guys true intentions are they are extremly dishonest in both the form and the substance. In other words, with all the lies and the scam like enterprise, were they to finally reveal themselves as trading signals vendors - which is likely the case- I would still consider them fraud. Note that I have absolutely nothing against trading signals vendors per se or any trading related commerce for that matter as long as it's straightforward and honest. All these reasons justify the posts you, I and others made. You might call it bashing or trolling but I wouldn't because it makes them victims; which they are not. Now we all understand ET is a commercial website too. The owner has interest in high traffic and potential sponsor revenues which explains why these clowns are still operating freely here. So I guess the real debate is wether we should "bash"/ continuously expose them or not as it generates traffic... Here is what I think. These folks started marketing their system here to establish a trackrecord and until they are done, ignoring them is not going to make them leave. They would certainly prefer that we leave them alone do their stuff peacefully without anyone calling out the scam and their lies But if you wake up one day and notice a kid made a graffiti on your house, what do you do? I guess you could just leave it and hope it will stop there. I think it's better to take it off before they cover the whole house. So is exposing them for what they are (fraud, mediocre traders, liars) going to make them leave? maybe. If not, then at least, we might have prevented a few newbies from losing money to these fraud. In any case, it's definitely fun to watch them get "roasted" as Baron would say.
You make some interesting point but I have NEVER seen exposing someone as a fraud, liar or mediocre trader to make someone leave ET when the person being attack remains anonymous. Therefore, it just doesn't work and the few times it almost worked...the person just recreated a new user name or setup shop at another forum. Here's another interesting point...if they're so bad...don't you want them and their traders to be on the other side of your trades (seriously). My point is that this type of constant bashing has NEVER scared a future vendor away considering they are still anonymous prior to going fee-base. Thus, as soon as they go fee-base...they stop posting here at ET (e.g. PivotFarm.com). Simply, if you want to make good use of your time & energy...it's more effective to find out whom they are (name & address). In addition, you can get your own free website, free blog, free twitter account, youtube account and bash them on your turf in a place you mostly have control. Next, make sure there's good metatags and/or key search words and all the major search engines will pickup all the negative information you've written about the person or company. That will show up any time someone does a research about the person that's considering using the service especially if you provide facts (copied messages posts, copied replies, copied trade examples they've lied about et cetera). It's a much more effective way I would think in today's internet environment instead of the cave man approach of the internet when the internet first started with those usenet groups. However, the only flaw with that approach is if your wrong and you've caused some sort'uv of harm...your identity can also be revealed as the person behind the website or blog. I think the above reason about doing it on your own turf prevents most from doing such...they (the bashers) are no longer anonymous if it goes to litigation. In fact, there's been at least one such case here at ET where it developed into a litigation (I don't need to mention the name of the person and company involved...it's a well documented situation here at ET many years back) and the basher was shut down and eventually had to hire lawyers to keep himself out of jail. Therefore, it's safe to bash here at ET as long as you remain an anonymous poster via not doing it on your own turf because doing the latter opens up the door for litigation if your so called facts are wrong. Another effective way is too actually document your own use of the "signal calls" and post your results of all the calls (not just the ones you think are wrong) in their own threads to contradict their posted results...I've seen such work very well here at ET and probably requires just as much time & energy in bashing them infinite number of times. The key here is too remember that winborn has setup shop elsewhere online (posting the same info in multiple different locations). He doesn't care that your bashing him here because ET will not be his source of clients. Instead, he's using ET for search engine recognition or to practice posting his signal calls before doing such at a real website. Thus, the fact that winborn is posting in other locations that has more of an identity brand...he could care less about your bashing other than a few replies to you. I've now spent too much time with this topic and you too...good luck and I'm done with it. Mark