Heartland/Sonic Securities

Discussion in 'Prop Firms' started by arnaiz, Mar 11, 2002.

  1. arnaiz


    Does anyone know anything about Heartland Securities or Andover in New York? Before I begin discussions with them, I'd like to know more about them and their reputations amongst traders. Thanks.
  2. I did some work with Andover and what I can say is that I liked their "Hammer" system for Nasdaq trading, although the pre and postmarket trading wasnt the best. Their NYSE Hammer Dot was one of the quickest I used, their commissions were low, but management or office support wasnt the best. And they had some fight with Realtick and are now using their own charting. So if you are a savvy trader, get your own charts, bring $10-25k to the table and you can negotiate a good deal.

    As to Heartland, I know the owner and a lot of good people who work for them. They are solid and trustworthy, but you may have to ante up $50k to get in. Good people though
  3. Weren't they the ones who were recently indicted for circumventing SOES rules several years ago? I think there was a post about this, and an article in the NY Times.

    They used to be the same company as Datek, but from what I recall, the guys who were indicted were not the people that went off to what is now Datek, LLC.
  4. no, it was datek, not heartland, and to be quite Frank, almost everyone in this business has at one point or another, crossed over the line once in a while. I wouldnt hold that against them.
  5. arnaiz


    actually...you guys are right. heartland is a spinoff of Datek's day trading operation. when the legal issues came about, datek spun off the day trading division and became a legit online trading firm.
    Is it true that Datek pioneeered day trading?
  6. Every so often, somebody claims to have invented some aspect of day trading.

    Popular gurus will imply that they invented the moving average, Larry Williams claims to have invented just about everything, and my personal favorite was when that Farrell guy basically claimed to invent scalping in his shitty book "Day Trade Online" (read it in Barnes & Noble). :)

    Everything out there has already been done. Fortunately, most "timeless" (and reasonably intelligent - i.e. don't spend your entire account balance buying calls) strategies will make money, provided you use them correctly and for long enough time, and can get out when you are wrong.
  7. tshoya


    Andover and Heartland are very similar in many respects... ie, software, environment, etc. In fact, Anover's Edison, NJ office is comprised largely of ex-Heartland employees/customers as is Andover's Hoboken office (in fact, they are in the same building.... 5 floors apart). The most recent benefits of Andover seem to system reliablility and overall payout for reps/prop traders. Andover's customer deals tend to be more beneficial to the trader as well. The downside to Andover tends to be it's super-decentralized organization and their remote platform is not as reliable. Also, there's been a lot of investigation into Andover in the past year or so including the shutting down of certain offices for violations of the short sale rule. Also, if you want to become a proprietary trader as opposed to a customer right off the bat, Heartland provides a much more secure, better deal for guys starting out with much more in the way of downside protection. While it comes at the price of payout percentage, in the current market climate, the difference is nearly negligible. It's really a matter of personal preference I think. Contact both firms and find out what they are willing to offer you. Mention also when you call that you are looking into going with the other firm as the two firms REALLY dislike one another..... I know personally that the owner of Andover cannot stand the owner of Heartland. As a result, it might benefit you to play one against the other in shopping for a provider/employer.
  8. wellmax


    I hear that Andover's Net Capital is only about $10 MM year end 2001. Go to a stronger firm.
  9. Do you know how much leverage you can get on 10 MM in "net capital"?