Guy makes $160,000 and barely making it month to month...

Discussion in 'Wall St. News' started by S2007S, Mar 1, 2017.

  1. Ryan81

    Ryan81

    That's not really accurate... if you add in the payroll taxes for social scrutiny (another 12.4% if you include both employee and employer portions, and almost another 3% for Medicare tax.)
    And sales taxes in my locale are over 10% and my property tax is very high...

    Throw in the fact that there isn't a single payer health care system as a backstop, and we must pay for our own health insurance... things aren't all as rosey as you might think on the surface...
     
    #161     Mar 5, 2017
  2. jl1575

    jl1575


    Fed tax 28%, state tax 9% (CA), 6.2% Social Security tax (up to 118K), medicare tax 1.45%, so it is close to 45%
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2017
    #162     Mar 5, 2017
  3. sle

    sle

    I did not. I said that a fair comparison is an inflation protected bond.

    Anyway, I can't imagine any sane person saying that a perpetual stream of payments that is adjusted for inflation is cheaper then a single inflation protected principal minus some carry. At least that's not true is simple PV terms. Once you start introducing other forms of investment you get into the whole risk adjusting business and it becomes hand waving.
     
    #163     Mar 5, 2017
  4. Zzzz1

    Zzzz1

    Well of course you have to take risk adjustments into account, else how would you compare renting and borrow/ownership in the first place. Or are you making the assumption that housing prices remain static? So in the same way should you allow for savings to be invested in a broad based index for a similar duration as the mortgage loan.

     
    #164     Mar 5, 2017
  5. Overnight

    Overnight

    JSOP, what is your average health-care cost in Canada? How much of your taxes go to your health-care system?
     
    #165     Mar 5, 2017
  6. sle

    sle

    Why are you limiting duration to the length of the mortgage loan then?

    To begin with, it's hard to compare apples to apples. You would have to make assumptions on so many things - mortgage type, access to refinancing, renter protection laws, property and mortgage tax incentives, current age of the buyer/renter, life expectancy or holding time for the buyer/renter, transaction costs for the property, access to leverage on the equity investment etc.
     
    #166     Mar 5, 2017
  7. vanzandt

    vanzandt

  8. Zzzz1

    Zzzz1

    True but there are fair assumptions that can be made such as the average long term return of a passive index fund and that handily beats any property appreciation over most 10+ periods of your choosing.


     
    #168     Mar 5, 2017
  9. sle

    sle

    For sure, even if you take total return on real estate (you are saving rent and paying taxes/mantenance). However, investing in an equity index (say SPYs) you don't get the same access to leverage and tax benefits as a real estate investor. Plus volatility of real estate is more comparable to fixed income. On the flip side, you get hit with horrendous transaction costs.
     
    #169     Mar 5, 2017
  10. sle

    sle

    Actually, found this:

    year median_px monthly_rent 10_year_$return annualized_return minus_expences
    2010 221800 855 174440 0.1458528428 0.1158528428
    2000 119600 602 94140 0.1190139064 0.0890139064
    1990 79100 447 61060 0.1293644068 0.0993644068
    1980 47200 243 43160 0.2538823529 0.2238823529
    1970 17000 108 13620 0.1144537815 0.0844537815
    1960 11900 71 9586 0.1303508295 0.1003508295
    1950 7354 42 7656 0.2605854323 0.2305854323
    1940 2938 27

    The point of it is that even without the tax benefits an average American would have done pretty well on his house purchase. Almost as well as equity investments.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2017
    #170     Mar 5, 2017