Gun Control

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Tsing Tao, Oct 19, 2015.

  1. fhl

    fhl

    [​IMG]
     
    #251     Dec 9, 2015
  2. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

  3. fhl

    fhl

    #253     Dec 10, 2015
  4. WeToddDid2

    WeToddDid2

    #254     Dec 11, 2015
  5. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    In an attempt to dispel the absolute nonsense that "more guns = more deaths", I've done some data crunching with information available at the FBI, and the gun control website ShootingTracker.

    The information is interesting. First, this is a collection of all gun murder rates by state, the detail of which can be found here. Sorry for the chart size/formatting. I've never pasted from excel/powerpoint into this forum before.

    upload_2015-12-14_8-27-15.png

    States are listed from highest gun murder rate per 1000 population to lowest. However, states in RED are those states where gun ownership is less than 25%. States in Green are those where the gun ownership rate (per 1000 people) is higher than 50%.

    The first thing that jumps out to you is that there are plenty of states where gun control is tightest (Maryland, DC) that have high murder rates by guns. In DC, hand guns are illegal. In EVERY SINGLE RED COLORED STATE with the exception of Florida, Concealed Carry permits are next to impossible to get. Feel free to check out the laws yourself here. Again, Florida is the exception. In ALL green states (where gun ownership per 1000 people is >50%), a concealed carry permit is Shall Issue and easy to get (provided you are not a felon, no history of domestic disputes and not mentally unstable.

    The second chart here details all "mass shootings" (definition from ShootingTracker - along with all links and news reporting).

    upload_2015-12-14_8-35-40.png

    Again, sorry for the size of the chart. States are listed by number of deaths from mass shooting incidents in the last three years (through Jan-2013). Of the top 5 states, two of them, including the #1, are states where it is next to impossible to get a concealed carry license, and very tough on guns and gun owners legally speaking - California and Illinois. Two others (Texas, Florida) are very easy on laws, and Ohio is moderate.

    In California, the top 5 cities are almost 40% of all the killings (172 deaths). They are

    Los Angeles
    Fresno
    Stockton
    Sacramento
    Oakland

    In Texas, 30% are in Houston and Dallas alone (70 deaths).

    In Florida, exactly 1/3 of all deaths are Miami, Kissimmee (Orlando) and Jacksonville.

    In Illinois, 74% are in Chicago or the surrounding areas (243 deaths). Chicago, incidentally, has the toughest laws in the country outside of Connecticut and DC.

    And in Ohio, 38% are in three cities: Cinci, Cleveland and Columbus.

    I wonder what all these metro areas have in common? I wonder if the guns used in the majority of these shootings are legally obtained? I'm betting they aren't, but sadly, this information isn't tracked. I'd make suggestions, but then I'd probably be labeled rayciss.

    I can send the data to anyone if they want to PM me an email address and you can parse it yourself or check mine for errors (there aren't any) or to confirm my accurate reporting.

    Essentially, "more guns = more deaths/violence", is horseshit.

    Additional source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2015
    #256     Dec 14, 2015
  6. Must keep in mind "Mayer's Law"*..... "When the theory is not supported by the facts, they will be disregarded".

    *a corollary to Murphy's Law
     
    #257     Dec 14, 2015
  7. Lots of data suggesting the opposite, right?

    I recall an article from Australia... where legal gun ownership was banned and all guns confiscated (legal ones only, of course). Gun crimes escalated significantly in all categories. Aussies commented to us Americans, "Don't ever let the government take your guns!"
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2015
    #258     Dec 14, 2015
  8. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    Gun crimes didn't escalate much, but neither did they subside. The types of gun violence changed dramatically. Home invasions increased. And why wouldn't they?
     
    #259     Dec 14, 2015
  9. What you say about "all categories" contradicts what I've read. But still.... once the bad guys realize their targets are "probably unarmed and cannot resist", they become emboldened.

    I'd rather the bad guys* have to consider, "somebody/most/everybody" is armed and I'm likely to get my ass shot off"... rather than "I can do whatever I want because there will be not opposition".

    *"bad guys" includes government as well as criminals
     
    #260     Dec 14, 2015