Government Unions vs. Taxpayers

Discussion in 'Economics' started by hippie, Dec 13, 2010.

  1. Yes, assuming you're referencing the work of Thomas Espenshade and his collaborators.
    #31     Dec 13, 2010
  2. Wiesman, I need to explain the root of the increasingly sharp animosity/hostility you're feeling from people in the private sector:

    As a fed-joint corrections officer, you are keeping dangerous perverts, murderers and other scum away from society where they belong. Not only that, but you are doing it at a steep price to your own mental health: I strongly believe that working in a prison is 'mind-poison', as you can't help but absorb some of the negative energy/karma that surrounds you there every day. (And I speak from experience on that one.)

    So why would a guy like me instinctively see you as an <b>enemy</b> instead of a friend, when you say you work in federal law enforcement? (To be even more precise, I actually see you as a gang member in the largest criminal street gang in the world... The U.S. federal government.) <b>Drug prohibition and the 500,000 'drug-criminal' political prisoners</b> are the main reason, even though I know you didn't write the laws- you merely enforce them. I'm assuming (because you said the inmates physically fought with you) that you <b>don't</b> work in an FPC (minimum security joint) where an overwhelming segment of the inmate population is comprised of harmless people who don't belong in the system to begin with. But still... would I be wrong to assume that many of the inmates that you help to keep away from their families are harmless prohibition violators who really don't need to be locked up in the first place?

    So why else would I see the feds as an enemy and an opposing force to the people's best interests? Because we are forced to pay you constant 'tributes' in the form of high taxes. My total tax bill (Federal, state, property, sales taxes, etc.) is greater than all of my other living expenses put together, and the same can be said for many people. Plus it seems like every year now, the feds find some new way to take away some of my freedoms. Prop trading firms are increasingly regulated/restricted, and I feel the various negative effects directly. I can no longer get my clove cigarettes that I like so much because the feds completely banned them two years ago. Online poker isn't nearly as lucrative as it could be for a skilled player, just because the feds keep messing with it and driving away the fish/casual players by making it so difficult for anyone to deposit money with a poker site. The economic damage wrought upon all of us from the lack of a sound monetary system (bullion backed instead of fiat) is another issue. And now dehumanizing naked body scanners?! I could go on all day with this...

    I know these god-awful federal government policies didn't come from <i>you</i> specifically, at all... but you are still a cog in that giant oppressive machine, and for that I view you as someone 'on the other side' ... an enemy. Do you see what anti-liberty politicians are doing to this country? Politicians and lawyers are ruining this nation, and it really doesn't have to be that way. I just want you to see that.

    "When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."
    ~Thomas Jefferson

    Please look at this poll:

    The people are <b>terrified</b> of you feds! This really isn't good at all...
    #32     Dec 13, 2010
  3. OMG that was a funny post.

    Your first paragraph makes it seem you will be addressing the general grievances that most people have with the government, yet you include a list of incredibly specific, personal gripes:

    -The ban on clove cigarettes that prevents you from having your favorite smoke.
    -Drug prohibition (yes, a larger problem yet for the majority still a specific gripe) that prevents a small fraction of the population from self-medicating (An alien concept to most people).
    -Government policies that keep the "fish" out of online poker rooms
    -Lack of gold bullion as money

    I am not saying I don't agree with you, I do. ...Yet somehow the juxtaposition of your stated purpose with your specific issues made me laugh out loud.

    #33     Dec 13, 2010
  4. I'm sure other people have their own pet peeves on how the feds have messed with <i>their</i> freedoms... I'm just providing my own specific personal examples. Feel free to provide your own...
    #34     Dec 13, 2010
  5. jprad


    Interesting that you quoted Jefferson.

    His greatest regret was not begin able to get an amendment passed prohibiting the government from borrowing money to fund their operations.

    That's the key weakness that's let us get to where we are today.
    #35     Dec 13, 2010
  6. Even if Jefferson had succeeded in this, likely that Woodrow Wilson or Teddy Roosevelt would have overturned it...
    #36     Dec 13, 2010
  7. jprad


    The President has absolutely nothing to do with the process of amending the Constitution.
    #37     Dec 13, 2010
  8. Strictly speaking yes, of course.

    But somewhere along the way, The Constitution ceased to mean what was intended. Woodrow Wilson gave us the Fed... that seems a good place to mark the beginning of the downfall of the Republic.
    #38     Dec 13, 2010
  9. I will take u up on that Mr. Reardon.

    -I hate how big government has led to the pussification of society on almost every level.

    -The security state. We are supposedly fighting "them" yet the government is turning inwards and directing its focus on, "us". I hate to see Americans cowered in line at the Airport, people humiliated, etc.

    -I am concerned about the future of genuine free speech. Hate crime laws mean the elite will define what is "hate".

    -It bothers me that every time I get into a modern car, it starts beeping at me to put my seatbelt on (I might be driving 2 bocks at 12mph). It is like having a government bureaucrat over your shoulder back seat driving.

    -I hate the PC that drives the, "truths we can't say". For example the population that commits most all the gun violence is small and easily defined, yet they pretend it is a general problem and pass laws to regulate all gun owners.

    -Health is 95% a healthy lifestyle, diet, and genetics. Yet, we cower in fear about, "access to healthcare." Folks, we are all going to die. Our forefathers risked their lives just to step foot on this continent. They tamed a wilderness and built a civilization. Yet all to many modern men go around with a fanny pack on, wimpering about healthcare!

    -Folks, when I was a kid we still played with .22's M-80's. We rode bikes with no (Gasp!) helmets, and this was not all that long ago.

    One thing I used to read and question was the notion some of our founding father had: A free nation "requires a people capable of self-governance." More and more I question if perhaps that is the real problem: The majority of Americans are now incapable (perhaps in terms of genuine aptitude) of self-governance.

    There is a smaller percent that merely desires to live free and is willing to assume risk. We were once a majority, but now we are the minority, and that is why we have the State that we do.
    #39     Dec 13, 2010
  10. Public schools as well. We have two options: Get the feds completely out of them and return all power to TAXPAYING citizens/property owners, or just shut them down completely. Those are the only valid reform options.
    #40     Dec 13, 2010