ksonsinc, Thanks for the tip. That's very close to what I have been trying for a couple days, and has given me my biggest profits (not that my profits are especially big). However, right now we're being trained on NYSE so I don't think any of these stocks are available to us. I'm trying to find something equivalent, and for the last couple days have been trading F which has been good to me. I am using CNN Money's most active list to find other stocks, so hopefully will grow that list
hey optioncoach Nice Post I think prop firm like these are BS Not only do they play with the nebiew trader but they end up putting him in the list of the %95 of pll failed I have to say a good mentor is very important to a newbie trader as long is is not letting the( trader student) burn and churn trading LU By the way can you please mention the prop firm name u are working with - ????
Ksoninc, I agree with you 100%. Foible, I think the prop firm you are at is just training you to trade as much as possible..... why? to generate commissions for the firm. The turn over there I bet is sky high. Try trading etf's (q's, spy's, gld's, dia's). You dont need to trade 100 times a day to make good money. Ibeen trading the q's now for a few years and make some good money. On average 5-7 trades weekly. I once talked to a couple prop firms and told them about how I trade, and they not interested, why? imo... wouldnt be trading enough to generate a bunch of commission for them. So, imo open an account with someone like IB and forget the props. Ib commish .005/share,, no bs software fees (like there is at a prop). With Ib the only thing I am not getting by being with a prop is 10 to 1 leverage intraday which I dont need anyway. Dont get me wrong leverage is nice, but its like a razor can cut both ways.
Hey foible Well what kind of a prop firm are u at and do they do only NYSE or they have a options for trading nasdaq I have visited a lot of prop firm and a lot i mean 95% are NYSE traders in which i have visited. I am a pure %100 NAsdaq but i know a lot of pll who are making $ in NYSE also but i am sure not scalping LU Well i guess u know what u r against and what u have to do Good luck again in what ever u do
optioncoach, We are currently only paying the SEC, gateway, and clearing fees. All of the transaction fees have been waived until we graduate. As well, we have not put any of our own money at stake - just our time. We are not being forced to trade LU and NT, and in fact, I almost never trade LU. I tried it for a couple days but it didn't agree with me so I have tried other stocks. One of the stocks that I have to trade is EWJ, so I have been trading it for credits and the occasional penny spread. This isn't my choice for a long-term strategy, but is just a hoop that must be jumped through. As we prove ourselves, the basket of stock grows. Since I finished three days of $25 profit with no negative days, I am able to trade any high-volume NYSE stock, though I have been discouraged from trying the very volatile ones. Still, as you can see, I was able to trade VLO, though it just lost me money. I'm now trying to select stocks which can make money, preferrably without a lot of churn. From what I've been told, the reason that we follow this path is that the slower-moving stocks like LU are easier to teach, give far fewer losses, and can be profitable. When we can be profitable there, then we are assumed to have some understanding of the market and an ability to control our losses, and more is opened up to us. So I'm in the process of selecting stocks for myself instead of having them handed to me, and my first choice was... not so great. If you have any suggestions, I would love to hear them. Not sarcastic or anything - I really am interested in what you can suggest. Yes, I've learned quite a lot. I find that many of the people here are very experienced and may not realize just how clueless many of us noobs really are. I've learned about the different ECNs, market players, mind games, tools and some techniques. Remember too, that I've traded CDE, L, F, LU, SLR, EWJ and now VLO and MOT. I hope that what these stocks teach will be applicable to others. The $50 stoploss grows as our profits grow. Since I have never made even $50 in one day, this is an adequate stoploss. As I become more profitable, the stoploss grows as well. I've decided, for whatever reason, that I would like to see if I have some aptitude for this. I am doing it full-time so that I can focus on it and learn without other distractions. They give me an environment to trade and practice which I think is a fair deal. If I feel stymied and like I am not reaching my goals, I will take some other measures to deal with it. Hope that helps you understand why I am where I am.
Yes, people here are trading NASDAQ, LSE, and soon the Nikei (sp?). Different groups start on different systems, depending on changing markets and the whim of the coach For whatever reason, we have been started on NYSE. Just as the number of stocks that we can trade grows, so too will the number of exchanges.
In your response I still did not see anything they are actually teaching you. Sure you can latch on to an experienced trader and have him mentor you if they are willing, but do they have training classes for you? Are they walking you through trades to show you set-ups and false breakouts, etc. Or do they just let you trade and increase your privileges as you are profitable. So if you lose money you stay in that zone without the education? Do they have a training period beyond what is an ECN and how does the software work?
I think you have it nailed - a brief intro to ECNs and software, then 'ave at 'er! Not very satisfactory, I'll admit. I discussed this with a number of other prop firms, and was given the same story. One firm did offer an interesting training program, but they charged their traders the same amount as someone off the street, so I didn't see the value add there, either. The coach does seem to care about his role, and seems like he genuinely wants us to succeed. He has given us many discussions about several different aspects of the market, and will often come in to comment on our trading during the day. We have different styles, but he does know his stuff and I'm learning. Now, I assume that you find this setup very dissatisfying. I've considered a few alternatives, and this one seemed to be the best. I don't live in NYC where there are dozens of firms to chose from, and trading through IB offers even less education. For the moment, I am able to try different strategies without risking my own capital, and if I am really dissatisfied, I am always free to leave for another firm (or leave daytrading entirely). Do you have any concrete suggestions, other than raising the obvious point that the firm benefits from my time?
If the firm is not going to take proactive steps to train you then you certainly should avoid becoming a commission churn for them because as long as you are trading and making them money on commissions and they limit your risk. You need to do your own research into technical analysis and tape reading to learn how to find your exit and entry points. Read through the journals or comments of pro or prop traders here and study what you can. IB has the same lack of education but cheaper commissions so you might be better off with them since you are not getting any money anyway. I know the prop shop offers great leverage but using it to make $25 is not really so great. You might do better with a small piece of your own money and lower costs. If you want to stick it out though, become a pain in the ass and hang on to any trader there that seems to be successful (by actual performance figures, not from boasting) and pick his brain for anything. If they are gonna do this bullshit method and not teach you then go get it from the best traders who will mentor you. I still think it is a crappy way to indoctrinate a trader. You do not get better in trading simply by doing it again and again without some context or system to work within and improve. If you sit back and do nothing you will get nothing. Spend half a day just sitting behind one of those traders (if he or she will let you) and just observe. LU is a dog and you do not want to catch any fleas. But take some time to run the math and you will see they are just setting you up to churn your account and if you eventually move on to make big money, more business for them. If you keep hitting your loss limit, they still are net positive on you and will weed you out. Do not be reactive and just sit there, take knowledge from others there otherwise you will be wasting your time.
We closed at noon today, so I went in expecting to try some new stuff and lose a bunch of money. Strangely, I made money. Thanks to MOT and ABS's wild ride, I hit my first $50 day (two more to complete this milestone). #trades: 15 #shares: 2200 adj net: $58.18 gross: $58.75 optioncoach: thanks for the tips, I think they're excellent. A friend of a friend has offered to mentor me. It's good since she can be very profitable (several thousand per day), but she doesn't live in the same province. I'll hunt around here for some help, and chat with her after hours. If that doesn't work, maybe I'll just fly out to trade beside her for a week