God is...

Discussion in 'Religion and Spirituality' started by studentofthemarkets, Jul 3, 2021.

  1. userque

    userque

    The probability of randomness evolving into the number 123456, or 'order' is the same as randomness (a six digit random number, in this case) evolving into 483059 (a specific 'random' number), or disorder, is the same. What is, or isn't order is a human construct.

    Admittedly, my example was more to provoke thought, than to be an exact equivalent to the theory of evolution.
    Humans can't prove this. Correct.
    Absolutely not. One idea is that matter appeared from nothing, and evolved into living organisms out of building blocks that were magically preprogrammed, whereas,

    The other idea is that a non-human, intelligent being, of unknown origin, designed and built our world.

    I didn't put a human face on randomness. I replaced randomness with a non-human, intelligent being.

    This is the tippy tip of the iceberg. I haven't even scratched the surface. And likely won't, here.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2021
    #51     Aug 15, 2021
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  2. ph1l

    ph1l

    #52     Aug 15, 2021
  3. userque

    userque

    If the universe, in the theory of evolution, didn't appear from nothing, then where/what did it come from?

    Let's say it appeared from 'A.'

    So, where did 'A' appear from?

    You can't escape that either it appeared from nothing, or it appeared from something. So the questions become, how did it appear from nothing? Or where/how did the precursor(s) appear?

    And how does the certainty and concreteness of the foundation: 'A,' jibe with the randomness of the theory?

    That said, doesn't the theory speak to a big bang?

    So what is the origin of the big bang? A big bang of what? And where did that 'what' come from.

    As an article I posted previously illustrated, it is more logical to believe that we are of an unexplained intelligence, rather than of randomness with unexplained appearance of matter and unexplained preprogramming of the building blocks used to create/evolve life.

    I believe in intelligent design. I'm OK with you believing in something else.
     
    #53     Aug 15, 2021
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  4. userque

    userque

    So, if the theory of evolution leaves open the origin of the big bang, then the theory of evolution supports the notion that it could have been sparked by an intelligent being?
     
    #54     Aug 15, 2021
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  5. userque

    userque

    This is a very good video. I'd like to hear @ph1l 's opinion of it.
     
    #55     Aug 15, 2021
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  6. I'll second that! :D
     
    #56     Aug 15, 2021
  7. ph1l

    ph1l

    If you mean how life on Earth started, it could have been something like
    https://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/article/100513-science-evolution-darwin-single-ancestor
    upload_2021-8-15_17-2-27.png
    What caused that and what happened before the first 10^-43 seconds of our universe is still unknown.

    Also,
    upload_2021-8-15_17-7-6.png
    :)

    I would think the big bang and life might have been caused by different things, but yes, it could have been this guy:
    big_bang.gif
     
    #57     Aug 15, 2021
  8. ph1l

    ph1l

    The argument in the slick-looking video is essentially is the search space for combining the necessary parts is so large, life could never have happened by chance. This is based on a claimed "1 in 10^164" chance of getting a functional protein. So if life didn't happen by chance, something intelligent must have caused it to happen.

    That would be true for a sequential search. But search speeds can be dramatically improved when they are not sequential, such as those used in genetic algorithms in software and possibly genetic combinations in the real world. So the video doesn't present enough evidence to disprove research like in https://www.nsf.gov/discoveries/disc_summ.jsp?cntn_id=117380&org=NSF
    We still don't know exactly how life began, or that intelligent life even exists.;)
     
    #58     Aug 15, 2021
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  9. userque

    userque

    Thanks for watching the video posted by @studentofthemarkets , and for your thoughts. For the record, the intent was not to conclude "exactly how life began."
    What are your thoughts on the apparent preprogramming associated with genes--that I spoke of earlier? None of your links seem to address that.
     
    #59     Aug 15, 2021
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  10. ph1l

    ph1l

    I'm not a biologist, but I would think once life began about 3.7 billion years ago, the first single-celled organisms had what you refer to as "preprogramming." This guided the cells' behavior including reproduction by division. When the cells divided or were exposed to environmental factors like ultraviolet light, their genetic material could mutate. Then, the cells behavior might change.

    As I posted before in this link, one type of cell evolved into the common ancestor of all known life on Earth about 3.5 billion years ago. Any other types of cells in the history have presumably gone extinct.
     
    #60     Aug 15, 2021
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