God is...

Discussion in 'Religion and Spirituality' started by studentofthemarkets, Jul 3, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. userque

    userque

    Chuck Missler was an engineer, and in his many talks, speaks to many scientific subjects, including quantum theory, with respect to religion.

    He did a talk on the current subject-matter of this thread.


     
    #291     Oct 22, 2021
    studentofthemarkets likes this.
  2. Stu, by completely dismissing all the evidence found within the Bible, you are ignoring the wealth of evidence that God gave so that we would have facts to rest our faith on. God gave us fulfilled prophecy so that we can KNOW that God is the only One who could have fortold through His prophets and then brought those things to pass later. Jesus even said, "I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen you will believe." John 14:29 It was God's plan to give us prophecies that were fulfilled, and will be fulfilled, so that we can know that He really is God and so we will come to personal faith in Him.

    But I have also shown you, on many occasions, evidence outside of Scripture that supports either Biblical historicity or shows our universe was designed.

    Here's some evidence outside of the Bible that should lead one to faith in God:

    15 minutes into Chuck Missler's first video (posted by userque) he begins a long discussion of design found in DNA and RNA and the impossibility these designs would have happened by chance.

    32 minutes into that video he makes the point that, "In constructing a mathematical model of what we believe we know about the universe, there are hundreds of delicate ratios that, if altered the slightest, would render life impossible."

    On another thread I previously showed you this video that also demonstrates the mathematical precision designed into our universe:



    You want proof of God's existence outside of the Bible? Look at the design that occurs in everything in you and all that is around you. Please don't tell me you designed your heart and gave it a heart beat!! You're life was given to you and your body shows the evidence of design.

    For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. Psalm 139:13, 14​

    Don't forget that there is also evidence outside of Scripture confirming people, places, wars and events described in Scripture. Here is an article written by a researcher at Purdue University discussing evidence found for 53 people mentioned in the Bible:

    “This evidence shows that it is not essential to have religious faith in order to understand and accept much of what the Bible presents. It demonstrates that even on the basis of writings outside of the Bible alone, Scripture does have a considerable degree of historical credibility.”

    https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/rel...e-of-53-people-mentioned-in-hebrew-bible.html
     
    #292     Oct 22, 2021
    userque likes this.
  3. userque

    userque

    To be fair, and as you probably already know, I don't think God dealt much with 'giving proof' to the masses after Christ died and rose. The evidence (not proof) is there for those that seek; that want to know.

    That would be like giving the answers to every student before they take their college entrance exams. You want the best students, not the best and the laziest.

    Every student won't 'get in,' period.

    "Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."

    I'm always tickled at how 'scientific and logical' minds are ok with spooky action at a distance, Schrödinger's cat, wave–particle duality, and other such quantum magic; but ROTFL at religious subject-matter.
     
    #293     Oct 22, 2021
  4. The fact that we exist, is proof, in my mind, that we were created by God. But that isn't the best way to word it. Gotquestions.org says it better than I did:

    Often, this question is posed as “Can you prove God exists?” The problem is that, while truth itself is absolute, there are virtually zero instances of absolute proof outside of pure logic and mathematics. For that reason, courtrooms don’t require absolute proof to reach a verdict; rather, they seek to dispel “reasonable doubt” and consider what’s “most probable.”​

    Demanding “proof” of God that no one could ever reject is unreasonable. Neither evidence nor people function that way in the real world. “Encountering” facts and “accepting” them are profoundly different. Airtight, sound arguments will remain unconvincing to those determined to disbelieve. For the resolute skeptic, it’s not “proof,” even if it would convince almost anyone else. A person’s intent is more influential than any evidence encountered.
    https://www.gotquestions.org/Does-God-exist.html

    The rest of the article contributes to the discussion of evidence for God's existence:

    Whether or not one acknowledges God, the decision involves faith. Belief in God does not require blind faith (John 20:29), but neither can it overcome malicious resistance (John 5:39–40). Bolstering faith are human experience, logic, and empirical evidence, all of which help answer the question does God exist?

    Does God Exist? — Human Experience

    Discussing the existence of God usually starts with logical arguments. That makes sense, but it’s not how human beings normally operate. No one starts devoid of all perspective, waiting to follow a robotically rational path before forming an opinion. People interpret life based on the world around them. So, looking at the existence of God ought to start with experiences. Afterwards, we can use logic to assess those views.

    Evidence of God exists in daily human experiences (Romans 1:19–20; Psalm 19:1; Ecclesiastes 3:11). This includes our innate sense of morality. It applies to the apparent design of the universe around us. Human life compels belief that truth, deception, love, hate, goodness, evil, etc., are real and meaningful. The overwhelming majority of people throughout history have been inclined to believe in a reality greater than the physical.

    Our experiences are not conclusive evidence, of course. Instead, God uses general revelation as an invitation (Revelation 3:20). Common experiences are meant to emphasize that we ought to seek further answers (Matthew 7:7–8). Those who ignore or disdain God’s invitation don’t have the excuse of ignorance (Romans 1:18; Psalm 14:1).

    Does God Exist? — Human Logic

    Three of the more powerful logical suggestions of God’s existence are the cosmological, teleological, and moral arguments.

    The cosmological argument considers the principle of cause and effect. Each effect is the result of some cause, and each cause is the effect of a prior cause. However, that chain of causes cannot go on infinitely into the past, or else the chain would never actually start. Logic demands something eternally existent and that is not itself the effect of anything else. Our universe, clearly, is not eternal or uncaused. Logic points to God: the uncreated, eternal measure of all other things, the First Cause of our reality.

    The teleological argument examines the structure of the universe. The largest galactic configurations, our solar system, our DNA, subatomic particles—everything gives the appearance of having been purposefully arranged. This trait is so strong that even hardened atheists have difficulty explaining away the appearance of design.

    Nothing about subatomic particles or forces indicates they must be arranged as they are. Yet, if they were not exactly as they are, complex matter—and life—would be impossible. Dozens of universal constants coordinate with mind-boggling precision just to make life possible, let alone actual. Science has never observed or explained life arising from non-life, yet it also shows a sudden onset of complex organisms. A team of archaeologists who saw the words I am here on a cave wall would universally assume intelligent action. Meanwhile, human DNA represents a coding structure beyond the ability of the best human engineers. The weight of this evidence, logically, favors the idea of an Intelligent Designer—God—as an explanation.

    The moral argument points to concepts like good and evil, ethics, and so forth. It’s notable that these are discussions of “what should be,” not merely “what is.” Moral principles are drastically disconnected from the ruthless, selfish reasoning that one would expect of a creature randomly evolved to survive at any cost. The very idea that human beings think in non-physical, moral terms is striking. Beyond that, the fundamental content of human morals remains constant throughout history and across cultures.

    Further, discussion of moral ideas leads inevitably to a crossroads. Either moral ideas are completely subjective, and therefore meaningless, or they must be grounded in some unchanging standard. Human experience doesn’t support the conclusion that morals mean nothing. The most reasonable explanation for why people think in moral terms and share moral ideals is a real moral law provided by a Moral Lawgiver, i.e., God.

    Does God Exist? — Human Science

    The logical arguments above are inspired by observations. Concepts such as the Big Bang Theory demonstrate, at the very least, the scientific validity of a created, non-eternal universe. Likewise for the structure of DNA. Empirical data lends credibility to the idea of a biblical Creator and contradicts alternative explanations, such as an eternal universe or abiogenesis.

    Archaeology also lends support to the Bible. People, events, and places depicted in Scripture have repeatedly been confirmed by secular discoveries. Many of these discoveries came after skeptics implied the Bible’s accounts were fictional.

    History and literature, for their part, also support the existence of God. The preservation of the Bible is one example: our ability to trace the existing text of Scripture to a time so close to the original events supports the Bible’s reliability. Judeo-Christian influence on culture, morality, human rights, and the birth of modern science also strongly indicates an approach aligned with truth.

    Does God Exist? — God in Us

    Each of the prior categories is an entire field of study and the subject of thousands of books. Yet the existence of God is demonstrated most profoundly, for most people, in personal experience. It may be impossible to “prove” to others that you’re happy, for instance, but that doesn’t change the fact that you are. That’s not to say internal perspective outweighs objective truth, but complex truths are often powerfully supported by individual experiences. Changed lives, reformed attitudes, and answers to prayer are all part of our personal perception that God exists.

    A personal sense of truth is a compelling way we know God exists, and it’s God’s intent for all people to experience that sense. God came to earth personally, as a human being (2 Corinthians 4:6), so we could have a personal relationship with Him (John 14:6). Those who sincerely seek God will find Him (Matthew 7:7–8), resulting in the abiding presence of the Holy Spirit (John 14:26–27).

    The question does God exist?, therefore, cannot be answered with absolute proof, but we can point to the weight of evidence that suggests He does exist. Accepting the existence of God is not a blind-faith leap into the dark. It’s a trusting step out of the dark into a well-lit room where many things are made clear.​
     
    #294     Oct 22, 2021
  5. userque

    userque

    That may be proof that we were created by an intelligence; but our existence, without additional evidence, doesn't specify that that intelligence is the Christian God, as oppose to one of the many other gods worshiped throughout history.
     
    #295     Oct 22, 2021
    studentofthemarkets likes this.
  6. userque

    userque

    While many may consider the evidence as "proof," there can't really be "proof." Otherwise, there would be no need for faith.
     
    #296     Oct 22, 2021
  7. True! :)
     
    #297     Oct 22, 2021
    userque likes this.
  8. userque

    userque

    Talk on the current subject-matter ... with a little humor.

     
    #298     Oct 22, 2021
  9. Stu will love the intro!!!! :D
     
    #299     Oct 22, 2021
  10. userque

    userque

    Right! He might stop watching right there in order to immediately post a response. :)
     
    #300     Oct 23, 2021
    studentofthemarkets likes this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.