Gingrich Wants A Middle Class 15% Tax Rate

Discussion in 'Economics' started by libertad, Nov 20, 2008.


  1. Put hot air in the windbag, you mean.

    There is no evidence anywhere, that "local" taxes are any good at all, if they dont work on a state or federal level, what makes you think a "township" will make better use of them?
     
  2. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aEZoCjCjrYDE&refer=home

    The two party system needs to be eliminated ....because of the
    special interest mechanism.....

    Eliminating lobbyists would however go a long way....

    .......................................................

    Eliminating the IRS....and thus the replacement via a consumption tax would give in addition an extraordinary lift to the human spirit in America....

    It is called ...."FREEDOM"....

    Freedom is worth having......
     
  3. jprad

    jprad

    Yeah, that'd work.

    The "townships" of Manhattan, Chicago, L.A., etc. would prosper while places like Podunk in the Corn Belt would wither.
     
  4. zdreg

    zdreg


    a phrase for a small or rural town that was popularized by the movie "The French Connection" in 1971, starring Gene Hackman. The film was about a drug smuggling operation that had french connections in mid-state New York. This was all based on actual happenings and the small, rural town known as Poughkeepsie was the actual setting in both real life and in the movie. Countless times in the movie, they used slang phrases such as "podunk" or "pough town" to describe the area.
    Today, the phrases have caught on with many individuals and spread throughout many states and towns all across America. By being spread through word of mouth, many people lost the true meaning of podunk and did not even realize it was originally used and first created for Poughkeepsie. The town of Poughkeepsie and city has now become less rural and more developed. Surrounding towns have all been overcrowded by many people coming from the suburbs of NYC due to the ripple effect. Too many people work in the city and live just outside of it, so they move a little bit farther out to escape the high density living. Even though Poughkeepsie may not even count as a podunk town anymore, it should always be credited for inspiring the popular phrase.
    Guy 1: "So now that Poughkeepsie is no longer a podunk little town, what else can we call podunk?"

    Guy 2: "Well Poughquag isn't that small, but it sure does have a lot of cows, so I guess we can call it podunk."
     
  5. And...if one does not like what podunk, USA offers...they can move to Manhattan...

    There are people from "podunk" that would not be caught dead in "Manhattan"....and vice versa....

    Besides.....very soon there will be quite a bit of teeth nashing in Manhattan for some time.....like rats living in boxes.....


    Also 10000000/10000000 = 100/100
     
  6. jprad

    jprad

    Less effective than having congressional term limits and campaign spending reform.

    Same with a line item veto. Better to have a one bill, one item amendment. No single person should be able to override bits and pieces. All legislation should stand on it's own to live or die in Congress.

    Nice thought, but you'd end up with that and income taxes, like the U.K.

    Categorizing income and having deductions is the problem. It makes the entire system more complex and expensive to maintain.

    Tax all categories of income the same, with no deductions. Make it flat but progressive based on the distribution of average income over the previous 5 years.

    Combine it with a balanced budget amendment and treasury securities become a fixed-income revenue generator rather than the monetized debt monster it is today.
     
  7. jprad

    jprad

    Er, the larger point seems to be lost on you.

    It's in the Corn Belt, who's left to grow the corn?

    The electoral college exists because of the inequities that grow due to unevenly distributed population.

    We have a representative democracy because of the fear of the tyranny of the majority.

    And, that's exactly what you're promoting here.
     
  8. Excellent Commentary All

    ..........................................................................



    The Fair Tax

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairTax

    ........................................................................

    Township tax management is a better management concept than management by someone who has no local hands on experience....

    In a township government....one approaches a truer democracy than the the lobbysist/2 party system.....

    However....there would still be a prorata allotment to national projects.....

    National projects would represent a much more streamlined approach approved by category....democratically selected....not special interest selected....

    ..................................................................................

    Furthermore the government should outlaw the possibility of any IRS like structure to ever appear again on its sovereign ground....

    ......................................................................................

    Hopefully Americans will have the balls to act accordingly.....
    ..........................................................................................

    Then the rest of the world would follow....or all of the world's best companies would flock to the US....leaving other countries void of tax revenues.....

    ...................................................................................

    Any government system that allows special interests to govern its laws and tax base is a failed system from the beginning....

    Think not....look at what has happened to the US.....
     
  9. jprad

    jprad

    It does nothing to address the unequal distribution of income and it would drive manufacturing offshore.

    Which is exactly what's happened every time a consumption tax is implemented.

    You don't have to look no further than the destruction that was caused by Bush I's luxury tax back in the late 80's.

    For example, the tax hammered luxury boats with a 15% tax and the result was that most of the boat manufactures in south Jersey relocated offshore to lower their input costs to offset the tax.

    It wasn't until after that industry was destroyed that the tax was repealed and the industry hasn't recovered since.

    That aside, the stipend for those at the poverty end of the scale only reinforces inequality. The inputs will invariably gravitate to the cheapest and least healthy food staples to compute the stipend.

    The result is the poorest can only afford the poorest food choices while healthier alternatives like organic produce and steroid-free, range-fed meats become accessible only to the more affluent.

    The end result is higher overall health care costs.

    It also forces manufacturing to bifurcate their product lines into cheap and expensive products. Cheaply built products don't last as long so you actually end up with a regressive repurchasing tax for the less affluent.

    Any equitable system should allow for the benefits of success but try to limit the opportunity of succeeding at the expense of others.

    You can drive out poor quality choices by having a system that ensures that good food and well-built products can be sold to the widest audience possible.

    Compensation reform that indexes upper management's pay to the lowest paid employees is the best way to do that.

    Eliminating stock dividends forces management to distribute those profits equally to their labor instead of unequally to their shareholders.

    The loss of that income stream for those on a fixed-income could easily be offset by an additional class of treasury securities for retirees that offer higher interest payouts. It would also protect their capital better than the stock market could.

    Experience is accumulated over time. But, experience does not necessarily result in competence, which is the most important of all management qualities.

    However, none of that overcomes the problem of scale. You can already see the issues today with school and property taxes. Smaller municipalities cannot afford all of the services that larger ones can afford.

    It's why we have neighborhoods that the more affluent gravitate towards.

    Which is why the founding fathers only made our system a representative democracy at the federal level. They left it to the individual states to implement direct democracies within their state constitutions, and most have.

    Excuse me, but a flat consumption tax is still going to require a branch of government to manage and enforce it.

    It's not that simple. You can have the best regulatory and tax environment in the world. But, none of it matters if the fully burdened costs of labor and raw materials result in lower net profit.
     
    #10     Nov 20, 2008