George W. Bush will go down in history as America's worst environmental president.

Discussion in 'Politics' started by ARogueTrader, Nov 29, 2003.

  1. Yup, you are right. I am a non-smoker that has never faced withdrawal from nicotine addiction. You know what else? I never had to worry about the withdrawals from crack, heroine, ecstasy, acid, and anything else you can come up with.

    My guess is that you would go through withdrawals from capitalism if thrown into such a situation.


    You know why? Because I never was stupid enough to abuse those drugs in the first place! I'm sorry man but as a trader I have lived my whole under the same creed. You reap what you sow.

    Abuse of drugs is a personal choice assuming one begins taking them at an age of consent and choice. To be slowly poisoned by environmental influences due to toxic chemicals being dumped into our environment by corporations is not a choice of most people.


    I will be 100% accountable for all my actions in life both good and bad. I also don't feel sorry for rapists, murderers, thieves, adulterers, child molesters and many other things. I never got a free pass in life, not for anything. I am far from perfect and have made thousands of mistakes in my life and I mean thousands. I have paid for each and every one of them. And I paid full price for them, no liberal discounts.

    Nice speech, but I am missing the point.

    But let's get back to the topic here, my common sense approach to the environment must be driving you crazy but the fact is it really is that simple.

    If I were emotional attached to your response, that might be possible, but I am not. I have interacted with people like you most of my adult life.

    I completely support all your efforts to bring facts to the table to the american people about the dangers of our environment.

    Thank you for your support.

    Ralph Nader will do the same.

    Thankfully he and others who follow him will not give up the good fight.

    At some point the weight of all the facts will make this boycott very easy and you will see the change you yearn for.

    Visionaries are often seen clearly down the road, but not in the beginning when they suggest the status quo be changed.

    But until this day, I'm sorry, I cannot support a government that is going to go after the hands that feed this country with jobs, all for the sake of higher environmental standards. I'm simply telling you the truth. Even you can appreciate that.

    You can chose to be a reactive, rather than a visionary and progressive personality, it is a choice.

    In this country at one point it was considered "right" to deny slaves freedom, women the right to vote, and there were no child labor laws.

    Fortunately we evolved out of those dark ages. I believe we will evolve beyond capitalism at the cost of the environment too, and hopefully the damage done to the environment won't be irreparable.
     
    #31     Dec 1, 2003

  2. MY point is that 90% of what the Kennedy say is BULL SHIT!!!....You should have seen the compound they had on the beach in Palm Beach.....Fuck the sea turtles, Teddy and willie need a place to bed down the betty;s from clematis!!!!

    As far as the environment.......who gives a flying crap? Seriously?
    I have been very consistent on this and will say it again: environmentalism is just another form of religious fanaticism.....When you take a massive dump do you pull it out of the toilet and use all natural bio-degradable compound to break it down into fertilizer to use on your garden????? ...Or do you flush it and forget it??? We as Americans go to great lengths to recycle a can and some newspaper.....wow...Huge...Im sure it makes everyone feel like they are doing their part but in the bigger scheme of things, its worthless....look around your house and think of all the chemicals that went into producing all of our luxuries....including the computer you are typing and trading with..You could help the environment by just writing letters by hand...but you like the technology and convenience of the computer and ignore the chemicals and factories used to make it and instead....concentrate on the Salmon and the SUV....BTW: If we outlaw the SUV, shouldn't;t Limmos, private jets, sports cars, pick up trucks, dune buggies and boats also be outlawed???

    We are all big hypocrites when it comes to the environment...

    SAVE THE forest!!!!...But first clear out some land for my 3500 sq ft home!

    CLEAN THE RIVERS.....But allow me to flush my logs and forget them

    STOP THE SUV and omissions.....But leave me my sports car and also take off the catalytic converter for extra HP

    SAVE THE OZONE....But i still want plastics and chemicals galore for my house because its convienant.
     
    #32     Dec 1, 2003
  3. Of course it is theoretically true that what an activist says may be worthwhile no matter how odious he is personally. But these extreme environmental positions are issues that are not free from doubt. Isn't the best way to judge a person's sincerity and credibility is to assess if they actually practice what they preach? Liberals certainly don't have a problem applying that principle to any conservative who acts in a manner they deem hypocritical. Well, this time the shoe is on the other foot and they don't like the feel of it.

    Kennedy is hardly the only loudmouth Democrat who wants to curtail the average Joe's choices while living the high life themselves, typically at taxpayer expense. Tom Daschle drives a Navigator. Of course his wife is a big shot lobbyist for Boeing. No conflict there, right? Barb Streisand, really the whole Hollywood crowd of deep thinkers, preach austerity but live like Roman Emperors. How about George Soros, the Dem's savior? He thinks Bush is a menace, but he didn't seem to be losing any sleep when his forays into the Asian currency markets caused massive hardships for poor countries.

    Too many people regard the "environment" as a black or white issue. Anything some extreme group pushes as pro environment is "good", anyone who opposes it is "bad." Unfortunately the issues these days are considerably more complex than that and require a balancing of cost versus benefit. That last .000001% might cost as much to remove as the first 99% while conferring no measurable benefit. The money could have been spent better on something with a much bigger payoff.
     
    #33     Dec 1, 2003
  4. The money could have been spent better on something with a much bigger payoff.

    Like what? What is more important to the future of the human race than the ability of the planet to absorb the consequences of industrial production? If you sacrifice the environment for the sake of maintaining our lifestyle then you may not pay now, but pay you will.
     
    #34     Dec 1, 2003

  5. Dinosaurs never built a car, a factory or aerosol.....look what happened to them??? :D
     
    #35     Dec 1, 2003
  6. The term "extreme" is uderstood relative to the norm.

    Tell me, just what should be the norm when it comes to pollution standards?

    Is Kennedy "extreme" or is he just more concerned about the environment than large corporations?

    If people like Kennedy and others don's stand up and make a case for the environment, please tell me who will?

    Politics is supposed to be a compromise game in a fair democracy, where we balance the needs of the society between the needs of pure capitalism, and thus far Bush has done little to nothing but grant business the rollbacks they ask for when it comes to environmental control.

    Had Bush done nothing but held to the status quo, that would be one thing, but Kennedy makes strong points that Bush appears to be bought and paid for by corporate money when it comes to environmental legislation and presidential order.
     
    #36     Dec 1, 2003

  7. Kennedy more concerned then large corporations??? THEY ARE A LARGE corporation!!! Give me a break.....he flys around in private jets and rides in limmos.......does that sound like the common man to you? Have you seen their homes? the compounds? the yachts? the Jets?......after they have partied on like Wayne's World for 30 years...NOW THEY ARE CONCERNED? How about giving up the sprawling estates and living in a apartment?....come on take the blinders off...they are using you like a tool....he cares about as much for the environment as Teddy does about women's rights
     
    #37     Dec 1, 2003
  8. A good object lesson...they encountered something to which they could not adapt.
     
    #38     Dec 1, 2003
  9. maxpi

    maxpi

    1) Kennedy passes laws that allow environmental attornies to get paid from public funds for suing soimebody over environmental issue .

    2) Attorneys sue everybody, even if they have to make up evidence. (Environuts put red legged frogs in a construction project and got busted for same)

    3) Attorney extorts everybody for millions of dollars which goes to a local environmental group and is used for finding or making up evidence of environmental damage.

    4) Attorney asks judge for costs and gets paid for whatever hours he bills, sometimes on matter how outrageous.

    5) Attorney donates portion of money to Kennedy campaign.

    That is the relationship of Kennedy to the environment.
     
    #39     Dec 1, 2003
  10. good points, TM. (as much as i think hannity is the posterboy for schmuck-dom in this country).
     
    #40     Dec 1, 2003