I didn't intend to tap-dance around your question. I'm detecting some underlying motive behind your question, though. Apparently you believe that God gave us free-will under the condition that he knew some of us would fail in its application. That is an interesting point to bring up and I think I can interpret this. By being human, we are all naturally imperfect. We live in a physical world with material desires and unbridled obsessions. However, we have the capacity to learn and grow wiser as we age. God understands this and has given us the capacity to repent for our sins. Even after committing them, we are still allowed to receive forgiveness from him. Debating and discussing God's motives for creating a physical world with people is beyond the scope of my knowledge. Obviously we are talking about a being that is well beyond my or anyone else's wisdom. He is an omnipotent force / being. Despite this great chasm in knowledge and wisdom between God and us, he is still understanding of our problems, needs, desires, passions, etc -- and still cares. Unfortunately, a lot of dogma is generated by religious organization leading to the injection of their interpretation of the scriptures. Again, the only relationship anyone needs with god is an internal one and not one that is ordained by the religious institutions. So to get back to your question, it is not so much that God is testing us, but rather that he has unconditional love for us, yet cannot look upon sin. Just translate this into something more local to your perspective. Your father probably would love you no matter what you have done in life. Your father would be greatly disappointed in you if you choose to exercise your free-will in such a way as to cause him pain. Through his love for you, do you feel your father is testing you when he told you as a child not to run across the street or stick your finger in electric sockets? These were his commandments to you as a child and these were meant for your protection. Have you ever been to a prison before? Have you ever been next to another man so consumed with his sins, that you could feel the aura of evil and hatred radiating from his being? Do you know how isolated and alone someone feels living in that sort of darkness? I personally believe that since God is purely good, that he cannot look upon sin due to the nature of darkness that surrounds sin. His commandments, in my opinion, are not unlike those of your parents which were meant to protect you as a child. His commandments are there to protect you throughout your life, since no matter how old or wise we all get in life, we are still child-like in the eyes of God.
Hi aphie, I think you gave the answer yourself: "... because the general meaning within Genesis is clear enough despite the translation." What is important about Adam is that he was free to do in the sense you understand about free will. Whether God forbade him to eat of those apples or whether it was about something different is immaterial. Adam trespassed somehow and nobody can doubt Genesis that God must have been steaming mad at him about it: Genesis 3:18-19 "Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou [art], and unto dust shalt thou return." I think it's kind of silly to start debating about apples and skip over the above lines. As to your: 'I do not believe it is necessarily to go to "confession" and have an intermediarary pray along with you to god.' This is incorrect in the sense that the priest doesn't pray along with you. He may or not say a prayer after confession. This is immaterial. The princple of confession hinges on: John 20:23 "Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; [and] whose soever [sins] ye retain, they are retained." So somehow, we probably all would prefer differently, but the priests decided to forgive only after confession. They where left with the discression. God isn't going to change his mind about this. He didn't wink about Adam either. There is no doubt as what is meant. Especially John is always crystal clear.
I'm not sure if I understand what you mean. Are you saying that I cannot pray directly to god and ask for forgiveness? John is clear, so long as you believe that he is a true prophet and if you believe in the new testament. The priest is not the authority on forgiveness -- God is.
You state that the motives behind God's creating the physical world are beyond your scope of understanding, but then in the same breath you state that -- "he is still understanding of our problems, needs, desires, passions, etc -- and still cares..." Are you not contradicting yourself with this statement? Leave all of the other stuff you wrote out and simply answer one question for me; If God does not want us to sin then why did he not just do what the brits tried to do in Burgeses "A Clockwork Orange" -- create all sentient beings with such an abhorrence toward sinning that they could not possibly carry one out???
Hi aphie, Of course aphie, you can pray and ask for anything! However, it would be foolish for me to think that I'm going to get what I prayed for, that seems clear to me. In our exchange, we basically quote some sources. So I'm not an authorithy, I'm only nononsense. I pointed out what the doctrine is behind confession, insofar as I understood it to be. Of course you still would have to raise the question about authority which we didn't go into. Now about John being a true prophet and being clear and about the new testament, again, wisdom is what we got and what we have to do with. As of late though, I believe more and more that God doesn't kid around and means everything precisely as he said. So I now try to avoid fooling around myself as much as I can. "Reason" is precious but very few people are capable of it - simply look around at chit-chat. Wisdom: everybody has it but it's very unpopular. Free will: no problem with this one, it's popular and practiced everywhere. Be good, nononsense
I think the answer is very simple: "take it or leave it", exactly the same as for Adam. Where is the logic in your "... that they could not possibly carry one out"? That's not being created free, endowed with identically the same freedom as God. (Endowed with the same power is althogether different!) From all the scriptures it seems very clear that you choose to go to God yourself or if you do not, you stay away from Him. He doesn't come to you if you don't choose to.
The same as mine. I added, our powers are altogether different. Genesis 2:17 "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." Isn't that being free exactly like God! You can choose to do it nevertheless.
. Gekko you are a complete and utter moron. If it seems as though we agree on anything then its either a matter of your mis-perceptions or simply chance.