Finally, they figure out what stock777 knew years ago

piezoe · Feb 23, 2012

Quote from maler:

Assessing a charge on cancels will not cure the fact
that you, as retail, are last in line to get filled.
Any changes to the market structure will be implemented
so that the regulators do not have to explain to Congress
why another flash crash happened,
and not for the benefit of the six pack retail Joe.
The market structure is by design dividing traders into those
who contribute to the kitty (retailers/buy side)
and those who own the kitty (BDs with order flow).
If you want to buy/sell some stock as retail, you either lift/hit the ask/bid and pay up
the spread into the kitty, or join the bid/ask, always last in line
(as time priority is a joke, easily circumvented by a BD), and get/sell your
stock when the bid/ask becomes the new ask/bid in effect paying the spread into the kitty
or missing the execution altogether if it were to go your way.
If you want better fills, tell the SEC to address the agency/principal conflict,
Someone bound by best execution fiduciary responsabilities should not trade for
their own account, and all payment for order flow received should pass through
to the end client.
Want to see fewer cancels, make time priority mean something,
make it impossible for BDs to subpenny limit orders in alternative
venues like dark pools.
If everyone were to wait in the same line to get stock, they will not
cancel and loose their spot in the queue, and as a result you will
have thicker books and more displayed liquidity.
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You have nicely summarized two of the many reasons Wall Street remains a cesspool, and even proposed reasonable fixes for the conflict of interest problem and the subpenny-ing to jump ahead in the queue.

I have zero hope any of this will change for the better from the retail traders perspective. I think you just have to understand you are dealing with liars, cheats, and thieves when you deal with Wall Street. It's the fundamental nature of the beast. Recognizing that nature is essential to success as either a trader or investor.

tenthousandmen · Feb 23, 2012

Quote from Joovenile Jatt:

It will be good to see where you will hide when the 2nd flash crash happens. Your right HFT has wiped out small traders, but if you've been trading in the last 3 months you would have known that HFT has wiped out TRADING ALTOGETHER.
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Cry me a river

stock777 · Feb 23, 2012

cnbs saying hft are scum.

glad they caught up to what Ive been saying for YEARS.

ps, they are making money every 1/4 because they are STEALING, not trading.

jd7419 · Feb 23, 2012

Quote from marketparty:

HFT is 95% of market volume so these HFT contribute to 95% of exchange and broker/dealer revenue and contribute to SEC fees. the broker/dealers need the HFT business as the commissions and in the thousands per month. and these HFT have the same privilleges and market information as market makers and broker/dealers..these HFT are the new market makers with market maker 'privilleges' but without the responsibilities of the market makers.

the broker/dealers sell their seats to HFT machines. The market is other HFT trading with other HFT and each trying to suck more cash from the market than they put in..

the service or value they provide is liquidity because there is no liquidity in the market. the market is illiquid,,just ask the mutual funds who have 100 million dollar positions, they cannot just go to the open market and do market order..they HFT bids would immediately pull their bids if they know some large mutual fund is doing market order.
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Of course this is correct, the funny thing is when there is no dumb money left in the markets these lions will have no prey left. This mess could be stopped so quickly with one central order book with 5 cent increments. No getting filled at 54.99768, just 55 even period. Of course this will never happen because all the money these firms have invested in "technology" will have been for nothing. They just have too much lobbying power, this shit will continue for a long time imo.

Bob111 · Feb 24, 2012

ah...another day as a perfect example how FUBAR US stock market really is,driven by the bots without any rules and obligations..spreads are huge and there no REAL liquidity. NONE. 100 shares on both sides with huge spread and that's about it. whatever is on the book got withdrawn right away,after you hit those 100 shares..spoofing and spamming is rampant on every stock..it's just pathetic,sad picture..

piezoe · Feb 24, 2012

Perhaps this is not the best place to bring this up, but is anyone who has posted here trading the European markets and how much of this nonsense is present in those markets?

stock777 · Feb 28, 2012

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW3DECKuXXU

SimpleTrades · Feb 28, 2012

Quote from stock777:

... they are making money every 1/4 because they are STEALING, not trading...
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Excuses, excuses..... welcome to the 95%!

masterm1ne · Feb 28, 2012

You are all joker... broaden your m1nes and maybe u realize HFT don't matter

"I don't exaggerate when I say, the people are cheating on the computer!"

http://babelgum.com/Floored

stock777 · Feb 28, 2012

right, doesnt matter.

so if someone wins 1 billion , 5 billion , 100 billion from the market , risk fee, it doesnt matter.

right

smart