"Being able to place limit orders at the bid and ask does not necessarily mean you make the spread." +1
I ended up getting sucked into this argument foolishly. Flexing my muscles to a negative Nancy type troll on here is not productive in anyway. It's that kind of mentality that can ultimately lead to me having a blowup day; this thread is reminding me I need to keep my ego in check. "I have to be right!" Intradaybill was saying that it's impossible for a retail trader to make the spread, which is not true. He also said that as a retail trader, you are forced to pay the spread, as though it is a fixed cost. A retail trader can enter a limit order and go in an ECN queue just like everybody else; his risk is not getting executed, or suffering from adverse execution (price fills him and moves through him), however, a retail trader is not forced to pay the spread except in forex bucketshop type brokerages. I never said anything about making the spread all the time. Clearly "all the time" is impossible, even for the Goldman Sachs and HFT types. Lastly, I'll say yes, it is possible for a non-automated individual with a retail platform to make the spread consistently. I evidenced that with my blotter, and I get accosted. This is all I have to say on the subject.
You can try to buy the bid and sell the ask with a limit order,..... but you are getting filled/your order is executing when the price move.
Exactly. I have been trading for 20 years, futures, options, stocks, with IB, etrade, optionsXpress, many old brokerages that no longer exist like Refco, even with Merrill Lynch. Maybe 20 of them. Whenever I placed a limit buy order with my broker at a certain price below the market, the price had to fall below it to get filled, usually by an amount equal to the spread. Conversely, if I placed a limit order to sell above the market, price had to move above it, usually by an amount equal to the spread to get filled. Whenever I got filled at the bid for a buy or ask for a short, I subsequently got screwed by a bad losing trade. Now, this joker comes here to tell us that a retail trader can make the spread through a retail broker. Either this joker has never traded or he is the assistant of a market maker and of course hasn't ever traded for own account because, listen to me joker , no retail trader can be filled at the bid for buying and at the ask for selling, unless he is on his way to the cleaners. Probably, this joker is exposed to some startegy at a pro firm but he does not really understand it. These startegies involve absorbing all supply and leaving only bids, no ask prices. Then, placing new bids and ask prices at higher levels that become the new bid and aks prices with a small number of shares or contracts. Then unloading incrementally the position at the higher ask price. However, this strategy is risky in liquid markets because when various robots discover the attempt they will react by trying to push prices down to force a stop loss. It may work in illiquide markers with unskilled and uninformed traders. Obviously, this joker NYOB doesn't understand the startegy they play in the office he works as an assistant (probably as a chore boy).
how can you open and close a trade without ever getting filled? If you have orders above and below the market, you need the 'price to move', no?
IntradayBill, you are right. If you are interested in being on the other side, send me a PM, we offer mentorship for selected people who want to become a broker and earn the spread. We teach everything from matching inventory of buyers and sellers to pay commissions for inventory. With my multiple connections in the business, I will help you get the necessary registrations so that you can finally( after 20 years )earn the spread like the big boys. Regards, Trady
Instead of regurgitating the same plagiarized material you downloaded from Google over and over again in this thread, why don't you tell us your own thoughts on this subject epicwinner?
Sure it does. Retail traders using say a Scottrade or similar retail brokerage account won't have access to the same tools, execution quality, or speed as someone like you who uses a direct access platform. Those differences surely have an effect on being able to scalp successfully and consistently.
Right. Since he doesn't understand that it simply means that not only he has never scalped anything but he has not even traded anything.