ES Points? Long-Term Average? VOTE!

Discussion in 'Index Futures' started by Scientist, Aug 9, 2003.

  1. Hi There Dear Fellow Trading Brethren,

    I thought since this subject doesn't seem to want to rest, I will give it another go posting a poll on this, hoping that this time, the poll is a little more accurate and that as many people as possible give an honest answer as to what their long-term averages are.

    Please vote honestly - Remember, your vote is anonymous, and it is for a statistical idea. The more accurate the results are, the more of an idea we get where fellow ET's are at, plus a good ground for discussion and possible improvement.

    All the best and Have Fun!

    ~The Scientist :cool:
  2. Looks like the first vote's got 4.5+ already. Nice start :)

    Since I started this poll, I'll better cast my vote later on... When nobody can have a clue what I voted... :D

    ~The Scientist
  3. I'm sure everyone is a winner!! There's no losing allowed on ET. Especially if you're in Brandon's $100,000 club. Then making $400 a day is easy!!!
  4. Now THIS poll's starting to look a little more realistic! :eek:

    Most ppl are on the below 0 / BE level! Wow I can just say...

    ~The Scientist
  5. Interesting...
  6. Quite amazing indeed...

    The current results reflect pretty much what I expected as reality... :)

    While the "average" of the consistently profitable ES traders is, as expected within the 1-2 pts range, with the peak of the curve on ~1.5 pts, the clear majority of the lot is either between net loss and 0.5 pts per day or right on the other end of the scale with 4.5 points+.

    These latter would be non-systematic, continuous discretionary traders, short-term or scalping-based. Since they don't depend on singular kinds of setups or trading times, like systematic (based on singular kind of opportunities, i.e. either trend or reversal) or non-continuous (based on particular patterns / times) traders, they dramatically increase their opportunity rate, thus dramatically increasing their net points.

    From all the discussions and opinions on ET, I would definitely expect the vast majority to be neither continuous nor discretionary, but uncontinuous or / and systems-based.

    I know from own experience that clearly following a singular set of rules or a system, 1.5pts per day is pretty unexceedable. Singularity inhibits opportunity and adaptive market tracking. However, once evolved from that kind of trading regime, multiplication of those results is indeed possible, given sufficient market exposure and a long, arduous process of continuous research and slaying lots of psychological demons encountered on the way, some of the largest of them being the infamous mental ceilings.

    During these times, while personally aiming for consistency on the non-systematic end of the scale, I am enjoying great discussions with both kinds of traders, to find out what makes up their thinking processes, in order to even further improve my (and their) game. There's nothing greater than communication with both kinds, since the contrast is indeed enormous, and an equally fascinating teacher.

    Also, since I started this thread, I would be very greatful if my dear trading brethren (and all the others) refrained from discrediting performance figures or claims as unrealistic or the like. Everybody should be heard for what they have to say, without inhibitions caused by potential attacks of disbelief.

    Basically, I would appreciate if this thread could be kept free from building irrational mental ceilings, and instead serve to lift and dissolve them, in the continuous process of evolution that we, as traders, all have to go through. I appreciate your efforts.

    All the Best & Compliments,
    ~The Scientist
  7. Scientist, I have to agree with you on this one. I could never use a specific strategy with a set of very specific rules. To me, this style of trading holds the capabilities of the human mind in contempt! I have yet to see a formalized specific strategy that can clear more than 2 pts a day average per contract. IMHO, the mind unleashed and allowed to openly interpret market data is the only way to higher daily averages. I think that Mr. Zanger and his trading style are proof of this mentality. Mr. Zanger obviously has a very dynamic non-linear trading style which comes from his TRUST in his own minds capabilities. He does not trade from an overly systematic rule based style, and as a result he has made many millions of dollars. It is the freedom of ones mind from the minds limiting beliefs that can deliver high daily trading averages.
  8. DT-waw


    EliteTraderz Honesty Index just reached new all-time high. Bullish trend is expected to continue as new intelligent people are flowing into our message board.

    We don't want to hear candletrader (only 1.5 pt/day!) or scientist (only 2 pts/day!) anymore. Instead of them we want success stories, strategies, and wise tips from REAL traders who average 4.5+ points per day on ES.

    Are you a prodigy?
    Are you successful (more than 500% p.a. return) emini trader?
    Are you below 25?
    Open to new exciting trading possibilities?

    If you can answer "Yes, sir" to all of these questions, join us! Much fun - guaranteed :cool:
  9. Momento


    I have noticed that the polls conducted on ET generally results in a U shape curve.

    - either a big winner, or a big loser
    no one is ever 'in between'.:confused:
  10. What a shame. You were just flaming the "mental ceilings" thread and now you come here, to destroy yet another thread originally intended to be constructive.

    I know traders who make 4.5 pts or more already, which is why I included those point ratings in my poll. I think the distribution curve on the poll looks quite realistic, so stop whining.

    And by the way, my 2pt. average isn't current anymore, at least not if you look at my performance over the last 6 months. I'm already beating that, and soon closing in to double it.

    And so will brother candletrader. Because he is an excellent trader. Very much unlike you. It's a shame that he and me must be mentioned in your posts. It puts shame on us.

    Have you got nothing better to do, DT-waw? What a loser. Besides, your literally countless attacks on people's trading performance are seriously wearing down now. This actually makes it pretty obvious how insecure you really are about this subject. We got your message, nobody wants to hear it anymore. Move on. Leave us alone. Thank you very much.

    Farewell, FPC#2.
    #10     Aug 11, 2003