EPA approves gas blends with up to 15% ethanol

Discussion in 'Energy Futures' started by ASusilovic, Oct 13, 2010.

  1. WASHINGTON — The Environmental Protection Agency has approved blending higher concentrations of ethanol into gasoline for newer vehicles, allowing mixtures with up to 15 percent of the corn-based fuel at the pump.

    The current maximum blend is 10 percent. The EPA announced Wednesday that the higher blend will be approved for vehicles manufactured since 2007.

    The move is politically popular in rural farm areas. But ethanol faces strong opposition from the auto industry, environmentalists, cattle ranchers, food companies and a broad coalition of other groups.

    The EPA has said a congressional mandate for increased ethanol use can't be achieved without allowing higher blends. Congress has required refiners to blend 36 billion gallons of biofuels, mostly ethanol, into auto fuel by 2022.

    THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below.

  2. Basically everyone except corn farmers know it's a government propped-up scam that's not good for cars, the environment, food prices or anything else.
  3. So...

    1. Every station will have to designate 1 or 2 pumps as "E15"?

    2. 2007 and newer cars MUST use E15 instead of E10.. or be in violation?

    3. There will be somebody watching all gasoline buyers to make sure motorists fill from the proper pump? (By "watching".. do the watchers take the customer's word for it when asked "what year is your car"... or does the watcher make the driver produce a registration to make sure nobody cheats?)

    That will create a few jobs at each filling station.. the "watchers"... and to pay their wages, gasoline prices have to go UP?

    Sounds like good policy, don't it?
  4. Actually ethanol is good for a lot of cars. Cleans out the gunk left from petrol. Yes I know some fuel injection filters have a tough time with it. Just for experiment I put 1 gallon of pure 85 ethanol in my corolla and 11 gallons of regular 85 with 10% ethanol in it. It ran fine

    But yes I agree the corn lobby supported ethanol is going to save the world is a scam. Last segment I watched from John Stoshel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9QQcP_Y1II

    E85 would be much more expensive without the tax payer funded subsidies.
  5. your experiment consisted of running E15 for one fuel tank. that hardly proves anything. deterioration of the parts and catalytic converter happens slowly over time.

    also, what happens to new car warranties in vehicles where they specify no more than 10% ethanol blends? will E15 void those warranties?
  6. This is such a stupid policy. Makes no sense resource-wise, environment-wise or economics-wise.

    It only makes sense if pandering for votes and campaign contributions is the overriding priority.
  7. da-net


    Ethanol is NOT good for cars. Ethanol is extremely corrosive. This is the primary reason that fuel systems ( tanks, lines, filters and fuel injectors) were changed from metal to plastic. This is also the reason of increased failures of electric fuel pumps, fuel tank sending units (float in tank). The alcohol portion of ethanol eats the coating (Tern) inside metal fuel tanks and leaves the metal exposed which promotes corrosion. Same thing happens to metal fuel injectors. This same action leaves the metal exposed to corrosion from high sulfur content in some fuels, it has become so bad GM had to develop an additive to slow the progress on fuel pump & sending modules.

    You are right about his "experiment" proves nothing, but if he were to run on E15 for an extended period the results would be catastrophic.

    I helped a friend that has a Ram 1500 w/5.9L that he tows boats with. He has had zero difficulty towing boats for almost 100,000 miles, but he had to refuel with regular grade that was blended as E20 while transporting a small boat.

    His truck was running fine before the refueling but after about 20 minutes he noticed a "small misfire" which he thought was "bad gas". He stopped into a parts store and was sold some Lucas (non alcohol based) fuel additive. He continued his trip, but the misfire became worse.

    When he returned I diagnosed the vehicle as dead cylinders (bank 1). Electrically it was fine, fuel injectors working fine...compression test on that bank revealed, center cylinders were 0 PSI on one and less than 50% on the other. The hardened valves on the center cylinders had stretched about .060 inches. The hardened valve seats were cracked. This is all attributable to the extra heat from the excessive alcohol. Can you imagine the amount of heat necessary to get hardened steel to soften enough to stretch?

    Yes, manufacturers will void the warranty on any vehicle that was NOT designed to use higher alcohol fuels. The manufacturers will have to adapt to this new percentage and make changes to the vehicle...want to guess who pays for that?
  8. The move is politically popular in rural farm areas.

    Big problem. The EPA isn't running for elected office. What is happening here is a new life form that has political power yet no accountablility.


    On a side note, this is exactly the case with GSE's (Fannie and Freddie).

    Gov't bureaucracies we are unable to reform.
  9. Good points. There's even been talk of the EPA enforcing their own version of "Cap and Trade" if it doesn't get passed. Scary.