It's time to talk turkey Tree. (lol...unintentional alliteration) Do you really think Joe will pull an LBJ and withdraw at the last moment? Would that be Rumsfeldian, or is it in the works already? Rumsfeldian for us maybe, but perhaps not for the Dem elites. We have no idea what's going on behind the scenes. Know who's the real puppet-master in this whole thing? My hunch---> it's Jill. Does she want to relinquish power? I'd bet money... if the Dems want Joe out, they know that road begins and ends with Jill. They are probably sending in their finest negotiators to deal with her. She might not want to leave the White House, and that mucks the waters even more. What if she's stubborn? We don't know. Will she do what the Party thinks is right, or will she tell them to pack sand? Is she the 800 lb Rumsfeld in the room?
It's amazing how one sided the media is. I mean it is so blatant. But what can you do? If the audience is incapable of critical thought, it's a lost cause. But things will change, they always do. This mess in Gaza has thrown some cold water on the whole woke agenda.
There was a time period (between Dec 1-Feb1) where Joe could have dropped out and could have been doing it as part of plan to avoid being a lame duck for a long period (which would have happened if he dropped out in the summer or earlier). At least there was a rationale for that plan even if it was not Joe's/ That time has almost passed. Couple more weeks left. Beyond that if he goes it will be just because he is hammered out based on disastrous polls, disastrous events, and just general panic in the dem party. Somewhat like LBJ as long as one remembers that LBJ made a choice that was not really much of choice in reality. Jill has a role and an impact but the powers that be are pretty sick of Jill too and -unlike some previous first ladies- she does not have any political power of her own to influence big players in the party. She and Kamala are just Joe's Visiting Angels. Joe may listen to her so she could help. But Joe is the only one listening to her. Some of the dems still have this salvation theory that they can go all the way to the convention and still move Joe out and put the ship back together again. Man, that is a disastrous, messy, messy scenario. In reality, Joe has morphed into the biggest prick to come down the pike in decades if you are Democrat. His dicking around has given rise to a third party which will mess up the distribution of votes, to be determined. It has deprived other dem candidates a chance to enter and develop campaigns to right the ship, etc. etc. This guy is baddd news for the Dems. If you are a dem, his legacy will go from the guy who saved the world from Trump over to the guy that enabled his return. Or, the opposite shit-show which would be for Biden to be re-elected and then put the whole country through a national nightmare as he declines before the world and our enemies pick the meet off of America's bones every step of the way. This Biden guy is a selfish prick. The media talks about Trump putting himself first. Yeh, well, look at what the Biden prick is doing. The thing that has not been discussed much or at all is the bloody dem convention in Chicago that will come out of this. It will not be the first bloody dem convention in Chicago. What a mess. Biden may LBJ or not LBJ at this point but he has passed the point of no return. You cannot unscramble the egg. It is true that LBJ went in March but Biden has to deal with the fact that his earlier dicking around led to the formation of a third party which is not going to go away as long as Trump is the projected nominee. Cannot undo that. Dems could have prevented it by putting up a stronger candidate than Biden.
Oh, I didn't even come close to disagreeing with that. I am just saying that things have evolved beyond what Jill thinks and that is part of the mess. Jill is out there today making the case that he is not too old and his age is an asset. But Jill has no power beyond Joe. Eleanor R. , Nancy Reagan, Rosylin, Hillary, Michelle, etc could influence their husbands but also had their own power base or circle in the beltway to go with it. Not so for Jill.
Yeah but does it matter that she has no power base? What I'm saying is, even if the party begs and pleads with Joe to drop out right before the convention so they can install whoever... if Jill tells Joe not to for her own (perhaps selfish) reasons... that's the only power base she needs. Don't ya think?
Yeh, again, I don't disagree with that. Just sayin it has evolved beyond Jill now. The dems are equally fucked whether joe stays or goes now. He has taken them into a disastrous and messy scenario. I think watching Jill's influence was/is productive up until today or maybe up until the end of the month. But any thought that the dems can fix their disastrous scenario by gettin Jill to move Joe out would be misguided. Joe has screwed the pooch bigtime and leaves them with a disaster if he stays of if he goes. Too late now to clean up. We are just talking about the color and shape of the turd he dumps in the toilet bowl at this point. The guy is one narcissistic self-serving turd now. Just ask the dems. Joe's situation is worse than LBJ's and note that even when LBJ left that campaign and the convention was a nightmare afterward. Worked out okay for the pub nominee, Richard Milhouse Nixon.
Just playing the devil's advocate Tree... not if Joe steps down and Michelle steps up. Disaster averted.
All fine and dandy if the dems think once you have gotten a candidate for the Squad and the progressives, you then have a winner in the general election. Nope. She is a Bill Ayers commie leftist. Never won an election in her life. Much easier to beat than Biden who can at least screw around with the "middle-class Joe" personna in attempt to survive in this climate where the far left is in trouble. Ditto for Newsom. Ditto for Kamala. Ditto for Oprah. Megan Markle could announce tomorrow and get a massive media gush and love bombing from some voters. But when you get these clowns in front of the camera explaining their positions on trans mutilations, open borders, spending tax dollars on migrants rather than vets, it starts getting dicey real fast. In regard to Michelle running, I am ALL FOR IT. I doubt that I will get that lucky though. But that is not even remotely problematic in my mind if she does. As I said, I do think she will continue to put that into the air because that "is a free trade" for her. It just creates a media buzz where she gets a pile of publicity discussing whether she should run of president of just be beatifided by the Pope. No downside anywhere. That publicity dream come true especially when she is beginning to drift out of the public eye with Trump having won and then the Bidens being at arms length with the Obamas. Super Tuesday is just up in March. Is Michelle going to be on the ballot. No. So you are looking at a floor fight at the convention if Biden drops out after Super T. Just a frigging mess. Again, refer to 1968. What a mess.
"Beatified by the Pope" I'm not so sure Trump's gonna be the nominee Tree, I think Nikki is gonna surprise some folks.