Kingstree started to experience difficulties (like most traditional business model Chicago prop firms) in the mid-2000's, and in early 2009 the remainder was sold to Harrison Trading Group (who since then underwent downsizing/re-org). I know several former Kingstree traders, and was told that Steenbarger was essentially a shrink who was employed as a 'trading coach'. DE Trading up in Glenview (my old firm) also had a shrink employed as a 'trading coach'. The upside to the approach is that the shrink can certainly address the emotional aspect, which is substantial. The downside is that the shrink will typically have no clue to tell the trader in question that he should be using X timeframe on his study instead of Y, or that with Z instrument using an oscillator with C timeframe is not practical, or that his interpretation of study divergence is incorrect.
Bone, Dr. Steenbarger studied the market every single day and often traded, as well. I would not compare him to most of the other psychologists who don't have trading experience. He also has a phd and trained in psychology. Most of the other psych coaches don't have Phds. His traderfeed.blogspot.com blog remains one of the best sources for trading information. Of course, this is not unlike you to drop names and try to appear as an insider. Also, as it was reported many times he didn't charge for his work at SMB. It was done for free.
Lucias, I never intended to disrespect Brett. I've met him a few times in person, but may not know him nearly as well as you.
I know nothing of the NY prop equity scene. What is 'bad' about SMB, what did Steenbarger do for them 'for free' exactly ?
I spoke with dr Brett at length during victor niederhoffer's 60th birthday party. He is 100% legit and a very skilled trader coach who truly understands how markets really work.
@Bone, Okay it appears you aren't familiar with Dr. Brett's work or writings. He wrote much to the effect that a trading psychologist needed trading experience. While, I don't know his full history.. I believe he did trade successfully at a prop firm for a time but decided he preferred helping other traders more then being glued to the screen. I don't have any strong opinion on SMB. Roark just mentioned SMB a few times and I just pointed out that the work he did for SMB was did without charge.
I have met the guy a couple times in person and spoke with him, I am gazing at a business card of his from a few years back - a Eurex Roof Party at Wrigley if I recall and of course he was still with Kingstree at the time. Agree that he is a first class guy, and I hope that I did not insinuate otherwise. So, other than a quaint 'reality' promotional series on cable, how is SMB suspect ? Parasitic business model ? I am curious. And equities are not my strong suite so bear with me please.
I can tell you that he is clueless about trading. Also, psychology has different areas: some areas are pure superstitions, some areas are half truths and half myths, some areas are closer to neurology, some areas are science. I can tell you that his area is NOT in the area of science, on the basis of what he is preaching in his books. Besides, even if he were in the science area, there is still a gap between the area and trading. You may do trading for a long time, but if you can't establish a bridge between the gap, you remain clueless. Clueless hedge fund hired a clueless shrink, imitation of SAC. Steve Cohen hired that guy, not because he was a psychologist, but because he was a Jew and needed a job. Steve basically was doing him a favor by giving him a job.
From being in trading discussions him on elitetrader, I can tell you he is one of the few gurus who actually understands trading. he may even know how to be profitable. he certainly knew when a fake trader was elitetrader spewing a bunch of junk. In the past when I read his blog he was hinting around at techniques that were once very profitable for me and a group of traders in my office. I believe most gurus are b.s.,even real deal hedge fund managers are frequently con jobs. But, based on what I know, I would bet Brett S. is a useful coach. Again, you would prefer to have a larger repeatable edge. But if you edge is weak or based on experience... I suspect a good coach would be useful. For an organization it might even be good to have a coach. a decade ago I used to speak with another famous trading coach and he mentioned that most organizations did not even let their traders know how much they could risk, how much capital they had or have useful stats for determining what the organizations real risks were. After recently finishing the big short, I would say that trader guru knew what he was talking about.