To those of you who think doctors are doing swimmingly just because you see them still living well, driving nice cars, keeping the country club membership, etc., did you ever think that many of these docs worked their asses off their entire career, were able to save quite a bit of money and build wealth during better times, and have good reason to warn their kids not to go into medicine (not just because of money, but the increasing headaches), and have good reason as to why they are trying to get hospitals to partner up with them to share the financial burdens of the new era of medicine, or selling their practices outright? By the way, medical malpractice insurance for some specialties, including OB/GYNs that actively deliver babies is around $120,000 per year, per doctor - in fact, there was a time where you couldn't get insurance in Nevada, and there were literally a single handful of OBs left in the state. Doctors spend half their day talking to insurance companies or filling out their forms. Now, with the unemployment rate skyrocketing and peoples' benefits being slashed, including med insurance, doctors accounts' receivables are going through the roof. My personal physician has told me they don't bother going after people in collections anymore because the success rate is less than 10%, and even when they get a judgment, it's an installment plan, and the people end up filing for bankruptcy. He is probably 53 or so, and told me he would never have gone into medicine if things had been like they are now back when he was starting out. Everyone in the U.S. with a job, full or part time, had Cadillac insurance policies in the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's. ...Now, not so much, with 50 million uninsured, and that number growing by the month. A pharmacist at Walgreen's that I know through a friend told me that 85% of people getting prescription filled have one form or another of government assistance, and that it's what keeps their business thriving.
I think one can categorically state that the most successful 5% of traders are orders of magnitude richer than the top 5% of doctors. When you're a medic you really cannot be in it for the money. When you're a trader money is the only reason to be doing it..
Any small business is tough, including a doctor's office. But a doctor's office is tougher than, say, a diner because, unlike a diner, insurance costs are ridiculous (malpractice, which among many other things means sitting and laboriously going over documentation so that you don't miss anything, because if you do and you wind up in court, it will come back to haunt you many times over), the overhead is crazy (if it's labeled medical equipment, it's automatically twice as expensive as anything else. Not quite as bad as a DOD hammer (10k) but close.) and you're in effect open 24/7 for your regular patients regardless of the posted office hours. Then there's coding for the insurance companies. And you still get stuck with all the crazy tax reporting a small business has to do, whether it's a diner or a doctor's office. Not to mention the usual personnel problems, landlord problems (most offices, like most commercial properties, are rented), crime problems, which in the case of a doctor's office are exacerbated by a regular stream of addicts coming in looking for a hit of pain meds, and you have to be alert enough to turn these guys away before you actually prescribe something and then have a cop show up calling you a licensed drug dealer because of it... Yes, you earn a multiple of a wage slave. But you work three times as hard too. Anaconda was right: the old guys have no idea what it's like for the younger practitioners, because the young guys have to pay for the overhead and the insurance and more than likely their leftover student loans (which are astronomical) and all the rest while at the same time trying to establish themselves. As in any business, there's a pot of gold at the end if you can tough it out. But it ain't nearly as cushy as it appears to a non-MD.
I understand the health care system in the U.S. is screwed and malpractice insurance has reached ludicrous levels, but with all the idiot doctors (and idiot lawyers) out there, many don't deserve to be in business anyway. In the U.S., there are many quality doctors and a fair number of brilliant doctors (probably more here than anywhere else in the world...IF you can afford it). But there are just too damn many idiot doctors who wouldn't be able to excel as a plumber or auto mechanic, much less in the medical field, but, since being a doctor carries a certain amount of status and compensation (and for the good doctors, justifiably so), they hung in there for 4 years of medical school, their residency and, by the grace of god, their physicians license. I say show these quacks the door. They're not even worth $60K a year and certainly not worth the millions they think they should be making.
haha doctors getting MBAs, thats a hoot. Im sure theres a few cases where it makes sense, and I have two overeducated friends making a killing with their multiple terminal degrees, but Im about to start my MBA next month, have dozens of friends with theirs, and it is 99% bullshit. Master Bullshit Artist. especially for someone who studied hard sciences for a decade. Why do they care about debits and credits and discussing at length how people in other countries act different than westerners? Im being overly cynical, but thats wild.
Someone on this thread stated that they know a pharmacist who said that 85% of all prescriptions filled have some type of Gov. assistance, If this is the case (and i am not sure as to accuracy) than it would seem that healthcare is in a sense already nat......zed (except we have 50 mill uninsured (seriously). What % of doctors income comes from govt/states??? Maybe gov. should pay off school loans and pay a flat salary to incentivize good doctors and Disincentivize doctors becoming doctors just for the $$$. ????? Interesting thread especially given current environment....
To me it sounds like rent-seeking in the world of litigation and legislation (a world dominated by JDs) has found its way into the excess economic profits doctors have long enjoyed. If it were not for the hospital/insurance related regulation, inherent market structure, and malpractice insurance expense, I don't think doctors would have these problems. So I say, blame the attorneys (and to a lesser extent, the MBAs who populate the insurance industry) for this.
All of you sheep do not realize how bad, and often incompetent American DRs are. According to the WHO......healtcare in the USA cost 2.5 times as much as anywhere else on earth, and is the 37th best. DRs in my area generally work 4 days a week, from 9-4. Almost every DR I have seen in the last five years has given me advice that was not only wrong, but the opposite of what I should be doing. American DRs may of had their salary cut from 500k to 300k, but why would I care when most of what they have done for me is wrong? They are amoral sociopaths and their suffering is deserved and appreciated.
I think it's obvious you are seeing the wrong doctors. There are many good drs. out there in the U.S. (I'm in the L.A. area) and yes, they still make very good money and if they are going down a bit, it's that they can't afford the Ferrari and have to settle for the new MBZ (well actually they probably could afford the Ferrari, they just don't feel like it's as affordable now).