I am talking about objective, fixed rule based TA. That's the only kind that can be tested, and when tested it fails. Despite the claims. So maybe we do agree. I can only go by what I have witnessed in real markets with real professionals. Looking at charts is not how most real pros trade. The market is full of deception, what you are told isn't always the way reality is.
Trying to get back into the groove of the market, which usually takes me a bit. Waiting for next week. how did this go to a straight up TA discussion? ah... marketsurfer... shocking. Professionals (whatever you mean by that) in the FX market def look at TA and charts, Price action... and if they don't their damn algos do. What would you find better to use for timing/risk... SL and entry/target? But do full-time FX traders exist? Although I can't see someone only sticking to FX after having a decent stake trading their own book, perhaps you could just work with FX as a proxy if you want to? Anyone talking about multiple entries a day from 1-min charts with super tight SL's in FX are 100% bogus in my book. Because of the spread and random noise at that level, you'll be blown out in no time. Especially certain if charts are all one looks at with no regard for other market dynamics. I am not a pro/full-time fx trader tho... but if tomorrow I landed a job at a hedge fund, I would be. Does that make these words worthless? Perhaps, however, I am good enough to know bullshit artists when I see them on these forums.
I am not a full time trader and I believe that this kind of non-professional traders are really not so many. Itâs better to take a break from time to time to have a clear mind.
Hi, Sorry for the delay. I have been traveling. Regarding those names--- Ed manages money for others so he isn't a retail FX at home trader. He even says there is no such thing as the trend-- so without a trend, how could TA work? Dan Zanger runs a for pay website so he clearly has other income despite hitting the trading lottery once or? Mark Cook--don't know much about him but isn't he an author with no financial background training or pedigree? AFAIK it's all self promotion but I'm really not certain. Marty Schwartz is a money manager with vast OPM, right? Not an at home retail FX trader making a living. surf <I>There is no such thing as the trend; there are countless trends, depending on the method we use to determine a trend. People typically pick a method for determining trend that fits with their current positions and/or view of the market.</I>. Ed Seykota
The above is the original question. I myself don't trade FX full-time. To the other 1/2 of the question, I gave a list in this thread of a few firms that have full-time pro FX traders. Yeah, they're employed (salary traders) but they exist. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDDe3M24AFA This guy Geoffrey Yu was a retail FX trader and he's now a Senior FX Strategist for UBS Investment Bank. He was a successful retail trader for about 2 - 3 years prior to being salary at the firm. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsevRonTbMk http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000146198 I first heard about him via his technical analysis charts of several FX markets when he first started working at UBS and soon after I met him in person through a family friend (retail trader). Later, I saw him being interviewed at UBS (a different video) and I was able to clearly see all the traders in the background, their charts with "technical indicators" on the charts. A few months ago, Bloomberg was interviewing a FX trader @ Barclays Capital and it looked like in the background there must have been about 100 traders sitting at trading desks with 2 - 3 monitors each. The traders closes to the trader being interviewed by bloomberg, I can clearly see their charts and what looked like price moving averages on price itself and indicators as subgraphs. The guy mention big layoffs in the FX industry last year and commented that he knows several traders that have gone "retail". Yes, full-time FX traders do exist...professional and retail. A google of bloomberg or CNBC video interviews of FX (foreign exchange) traders confirms such. I think the issue for the thread starter and other traders is that there are a lot of retail traders (at home traders) without an in person social network involving other full-time traders (professional and retail). Thus, its easy for them to quickly develop doubts about the existence of full-time traders due to the lack of their own personal social network especially after the financial crisis (collapse) of 2008 and the continuing European crisis. FX is a trillion dollar business being traded...surely someone must be trading and doing such full-time. By the way, I'm still curious why I don't see North Americans winning those FX Dukascopy trader competitions...aren't there any FX traders in the U.S. or Canada. You ain't gonna meet another trader in person if you're retail (at home) studying the charts every day...all day. You need to get outside, go places and meet people. This ain't rocket science and you don't need an IVY league network especially with the help of social media (e.g. facebook, twitter, stocktwits, linkedin, conventions, expos, trader tournaments and so).
"When the red crosses the blue, the RSI and Stochastic are at x Go long" The markets are a fluid on going development with a million if and buts yet just enough coherency to get by, I am going to be honest with you when I say I did not think you would be arguing against such systems. I have always assumed they were a crutch used until enough screen time has been invested to subconsiously react to what one is seeing in the market, used as a frame work to note how the market reacts around it, its indiscrepancies and so forth. A set of rules to focus on while you learn the market in relation to them and by doing so you learn the behaviour of the market. I mentioned above that I can not articulate the way I trade 100%, I liken it to driving, the controls of a vehicle are standardized, there are fixed mechanical rules to follow concerning gas steering and braking etc. There is a code of conduct to follow while interacting with other traffic yet every situation is new. We may drive down the same roads every day with the same vehicles surrounding us and despite the code of conduct and fixed mechanical rules all drivers are operating under any trip has the potential to be anything from the mundane to life threatening. How we are able to read and react to these situations is a product of our expereince, even when faced with a situation we have never come across, if we are expereinced enough we can react to it, yet we may not know why we reacted that way, why we sensed something was up. Having fixed rules for every situation with trading is as bizzare as having fixed rules of response for every single situation one comes across when driving, there are vital rules needed with both but you can never legislate every response beyond those vital few, it would restrict your response in fatal ways, experience and the actions born out of that expereince are the only things we can rely on. If people really do buy/create such inflexible systems, blow an account and simply go on to get another system, then another, looking for the "holy grail" of trading, without paying attention to the raw market unfolding infront of them, then our old boy EMG is out of a job isent he, as 100% of those who do a skydive without a parachute die to. Point being I did not think you would be arguing about the obvious and Xpurts combination of TA/chart reading and producing a game plan for the current market hes seeing does not equate to this crap, although they do get complex. The above is not to say if you have a dam good method it cant be taught however, it depends on the individual. Buffet does not use a chart, surely its down to the indivdual? http://dc589.2shared.com/download/KLk0WtT7/ABC.png?tsid=20130428-052429-91eb53dd I would not have entered this in 2009 on the say so of two lines but I wouldt have entered it without taking the chart into consideration either, fundamentals etc are fantastic but you can still enter on the edge of a cliff, if its a long term play then for some it does not matter as much. Do long/short- emerging/aggressive growth - the majority of hedge and mutual funds not use charts at all? I think a problem with todays crowd and TA/systems is how accessible it all is. Decide you want to be a trader join a forum and within minutes you can have a demo account up and running with a full system. There are thousands of systems and indicators on the forex forums, back in the day people had their charts printed out or drew them, with each update in time drawing in and caculating their indicators, at times having to redraw entire charts. The understanding gained from this vs todays newbie who spends the majority of his time looking at indicators he doesent understand the maths behind instead of the market its self developing must be immense, I spent my first two weeks drawing what I was seeing unfold on screen, dear god it was boring but I knew it would serve me well. There is so much on offer today that people are expected, or rather expect to run with these systems before they can walk. Peace.
Excellent, you are not a full time home trader yet you are good enough to walk into a hedge fund Monday and work it on the same level as the professionals, being good enough to work with the pros and spot bullshit when you see it, why dont you show us your skills and let us know what time frames the following two charts are: http://dc589.2shared.com/download/gw20QEnQ/Mystical_Charts.JPG?tsid=20130428-062634-63f25924 Then if you will explain to us why you can get the job done on higher time frames, with greater stop loss risks, yet cant get it done on lower time frames, other than you personally lack the skill to..which is perfectly fine, but please do not blame the spread its the same amount which ever time frame you are basing your choice on.
there may not be difference in chart. Where difference comes into play is when entering 100 lots position. 5 pip stop will likely get attention and subsequent market action may be centered around that stop. 50 pips stop much less chance. So, 5 pip stop will keep trader in up to 5 lot size and scale up attempt will likely cause deterioration of performance and inability to get to next level.
And if there is no difference in the chart it can be traded just like any chart on the count that its a chart....Trade size is seperate consideration (y)