Discretionary vs fully Systematic

Discussion in 'Psychology' started by alphadillo, May 26, 2023.

Are you discretionary or fully systematic?

  1. Discretionary only

    6 vote(s)
    24.0%
  2. Systematic only

    8 vote(s)
    32.0%
  3. Mix of both

    11 vote(s)
    44.0%
  1. newwurldmn

    newwurldmn

    80% of the time I follow the rules. But 20% of the time I don't. I have to justify why I don't.
     
    #11     Jun 12, 2023
  2. PPC

    PPC

    You have a re-evaluation rule,
     
    #12     Jun 12, 2023
  3. Dollardogs

    Dollardogs

    Sounds like we're in a very similar place. My background not in finance. I also started trading part-time in 2020 but haven't found consistency yet. I also think I know exactly what you mean by "fighting at the borders" of your system. Although I've built a pretty detailed system, I still find myself on too many days convincing myself today's scenario is something my system hasn't yet "accounted for," and that leads to some discretionary judgment (which either works or doesn't) followed by an updating/expanding of my rules after the fact. That dangerous habit has led me to seek out a more systematic approach where I have less and less say over things, and yet there always seems to be these moments where interpretation (of single trigger candles, or larger patterns) is needed, and that's where things usually go awry for me. I still have a long way to go, I've come to realize, but I do think backtesting and writing out your plan IN DETAIL holds one more accountable and thereby improves discipline. As others have said, you won't obey a system you don't believe in, and that's where thorough backtesting comes into play and can really help your discipline improve. One question for you: are you trading multiple things? For relative beginners like ourselves, I'm a big believer in really getting to know a single instrument, only trading one thing and backtesting it in a way where you get used to all its main scenarios, its quirks, etc. This is all very general, but hopefully helpful in some way.
     
    #13     Jun 24, 2023
    alphadillo likes this.
  4. Dollardogs

    Dollardogs

    Is there a rule for re-evaluating rules?
     
    #14     Jun 24, 2023
    murray t turtle likes this.
  5. %%
    YES;
    P+L helps.
    SEE if you can beat a benchmark like buy + hold one share of SPY or SPLV, VOO,QQQ .
    Except for buy every month for 30 year$ most sy$tems so badly underperform.
    Good thing about trading or investing;
    all most impossible to as bad as lotto\ = as stupid tax on people at cant do math.
    Rather than pshchobabble it, research it............................................
    US money has included, silver, gold, copper coins , tobacco, beaver skins, buck skins[aka bucks]pennies, half pennies, copper pennies the size of half dollars-rare, wampum\
    dimes , half dimes, silver half dollars, silver dollars, Fed Reserve notes,[ silver certs, no longer redeemable in silver]
    Even though SPLV is an underperformer, good beginning low vol /good volume learn ETF, not in that one now. Wisdom is profitable to direct
     
    #15     Jun 26, 2023
  6. virtusa

    virtusa

    No it is not. It can be part rules and part discretionary. If you are good, this combination cannot be beaten. The discretionary part is the correct analysis of the results of the rules. In certain things the human brain is unbeatable. A discretionary analysis can be too difficult to program in rules. The (well trained) brain can manage that information much faster, more flexible and much more accurate. But not every human has a brain that is capable of doing that. In fact the large majority is unable to do the discretionarty part efficiently.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2023
    #16     Jun 26, 2023
    murray t turtle likes this.
  7. virtusa

    virtusa

    Not following the rules 20% of the time, is also a rule. At least if you know why you skipped the rule.
     
    #17     Jun 26, 2023
  8. virtusa

    virtusa

    Because the discretionary part tells you why to break the rule, or rather replace the rule by another rule.
    Some (discretionary) rules can overrule other rules. You don't break rules. The rule is to overrule a rule by a discretionary rule.
    A discretionary trader tries to put everything in fixed rules; only when that is impossible he switches to discretionary rules. For me "discretionary" means "logical".
     
    #18     Jun 26, 2023
  9. deaddog

    deaddog

    I'm probably one of those whos brain isn't capable of doing that.
    I know from my experience that I get into less trouble when I follow my rules. :)
     
    #19     Jun 26, 2023
  10. deaddog

    deaddog

    Can you give me an example of a logical rule that isn't one of your rules.
    Maybe my rule set is larger than most. I hope that my trading plan answers the question "What do I do now?" If you have discrectionary rules it sounds like you are not sure.
     
    #20     Jun 26, 2023