I watched the entire trade happen, and it was actually 308k and maybe some 'change'. In any case, it was quite a loss, and he was closed out of the trade by the broker via a margin call. It was a Russell Futures trade, and he did continue to pile on contracts. I think the final number of contracts on the trade was 1000 - but I am not 100% sure on that. I actually did that trade with him, but had set a small stop. I was out of the trade almost immediately, and watched his unfold. I was a member of TTM before Hoffman joined them, and then in the paid trading room every day for 9 months while he was running it. Though I did have some takeaways in the form of useful practical information that I now use in my trading, it is my opinion that I paid WAY too much for that information. The exorbitant pricing was the reason that I cancelled. So, though I do think that he and they have offered good information that I can apply, they are charging a ridiculously inflated premium for it. It is my humble belief that if they were as good as they say that they are, then they should have no problem offering their wisdom at far more affordable rates. I have seen this over and over, there are people in the industry who do actually have useful things to teach, but they are so stingy with their information, that the value is almost all lost. I disagree with the idea that if they can get away with it, they should charge whatever they can get away with. As far as Hoffman is concerned, I did some rough estimating based upon the trades that I SAW him do every day, and based upon that, it was my guess that his 308k loss took out about 2 years of day-trading gains. He does have a very large trading account, (and he does do other longer term investments and trades that the public can't see), and can take a hit like that and keep going, HOWEVER, he would not be in the teaching/seminar/trading room/indicator biz, if he was making so much money trading. I think that if they were making so much money trading, then he, and TTM would just trade. They are clearly not philanthropic in their intentions, so clearly the money they get from their attendees is the motivation. I believe that Hoffman alienated alot of people by being so condescending in his approach. He was generally very rude and talked down to people. He also spoke quite disparagingly on a daily basis about "junior traders", those idiots who didn't trade by his guidelines. I think that if someone is truly teaching and sharing something of value, the teacher respects the students and sincerely desires successful application of the principles for every student. Hoffman talked the teacher talk, but really did not do the teacher walk. Ultimately, this is a very individual occupation, and there are as many ways to maneuver it as there are people. I think the only basic truth about trading is that one must find one's own way, and if lucky enough to hit on the right combination, run with it for as long as it works. When it is time to make adjustments, make adjustments. Hoffman and the TTM crew have taken a tactic that I don't entirely agree with, but there are still people out there (myself included), who were/are willing to cough up the dough. I have learned my lesson. Perhaps that is part of the game, though I would rather not have had to pay so much for it.
Does anyone know how well has he done with his daytrading after the blow-up? Even if he has managed to do well with his daytrading after the blow-up, I doubt that most people who join the room and try to shadow his trades will be making money over the long haul in his room. It's just too risky and stressful....and the monthly fee is expensive on top of that. If it were that easy, then we could all just quit our day jobs and join his room....and win instead of getting chopped up.
Do guys like this register as trading advisors or do they put out the live calls under the guise of education?
Incidentally, Hoffman and TTM have parted ways, and now he has a site called BBT, which looks almost identical in format to TTM's site. I think TTM's site looks marginally better, but I don't think that either site is very well designed. This seems to be a recent development, and one that also appears to have been on negative terms, since TTM makes no mention of their association with Hoffman, nor the reason for the now dis-association. Interesting. Based upon my experience with Hoffman directly, I believe that it is possible that he may have insulted too many people in the room, and TTM was tired of seeing so much attrition. It is just a theory. I find it quite funny that Hoffman's new site, (no more powercharting.com), is an uglier version of the TTM site. Whatever. They'll keep finding new suckers who will eventually get wise. I still keep an eye on TTM, and take whatever free stuff they offer, but they won't be getting any more of my cash. My advice; don't overpay for something because of the promise of invisible rewards that might appear later. As in trading, if you are comfortable with the risk, then go for it. If your spidey sense says get out, then get the h--- out. Over time, with practice, instinct improves. Same in life.
Lot of posts on this thread.. I got to p.37 before jumping in here. I was in the TTM room with Rob during this trade and can assure you it was for real. Here's how it went down: Someone else was handling the room for Rob while he was either leading a webinar or at a live trading event. So he came into the room mid-morning and took over the LTR. Hurried, discombobulated. Not really "ready to trade" No trades were placed during the event that he just left. He hasn't had a losing trade in 15 months. Nice track record. Pressure to keep it up. Earlier in the week, there was a storm in Chicago that knocked out power to his new crib and there was no generator installed. So there were either 1 or 2 days at home with no lights, and no charts. That is probably stressful. His son may have just left for the military and I think that his pet just died. That is stressful. Why am I telling you this? Because there were a lot of reasons that Rob and most mortals should not have been trading. He went long TF with 1 or a few contracts and the market went against him. He traded his style by scaling in. There was a point when this trade was +$5,000 but he did not close it out. And then suddenly, without warning, President Obama came on the television. The market tanked. Rob continued to scale in. At one point he was +571 contracts and in the hole ($101,000) He continued scaling in each time the market paused. I'm a noob trader and I followed. I went long 1 TF every time Rob added more contracts. Each time the market continued down, I got stopped out until I went limit-down on the day. (LOL - I can hear the disparaging posts being readied for me on this thread) When it was all said and done, he was long +841 TF contracts. Rob's Infinity DOM froze and filled an empty screen with an hourglass. When the hourglass went away after a full minute, it said "position liquidated by risk manager -$307,000" I shat myself, and even vomited a little. Rob remained calm and said in his normal tone. "Well gang, that's all for today." I had been in the LTR for several weeks and was learning how to scale in and thought it was a fantastic method. This trade is forever burned into my brain and is my favorite trade discussion at parties. I did not make any money in the TTM live room with Rob. Rob talked more than he traded. Rob is a very good trader. Rob is a very good instructor. I like Rob and have respect for his teaching and trading methods. There are no hard feelings. I came away from the TTM LTR with this: Don't trade the chop. Wait for a whoosh. Sit on your hands until the whoosh arrives, and then be aggressive. Never scale into a losing trade. Never follow anyone else into a trade.
Rob talked more than he traded. It took a while for me to figure out that my 1-lot entries should be well after his entry, and most likely on one of his scale-ins. Conservative trades vs aggressive (early and right) trades. My inability to become CP is not Rob's fault. It is a fault of my own. The days spent in the TTM LTR had some very good lessons... the abundance will come in time. Good trading to you.
lol, dude, can't you understand that averaging down is a scheme to show high % of win trades while losing money overall in order to sell subscriptions?Its wildly used among people who sell trading signal services