dems good at blame deflection

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by Mav88, Oct 11, 2008.

  1. Mav88

    Mav88

    Hag Pelosi and company sucessfully blame republican deregulation for the subprime debacle, all the while republicans (and greenspan) were the ones sounding the alarms and asking for regulation of fannie, while demos didn't do a damn thing. Just how does this work exactly?


    This subprime crap was a Clinton idea, instigated by his policies, fueled by the CRA revisions initially, then later by Fannies implicit guarantees and massive purchases of subprime securities. Fannie was given explicit targets for its 'special affordable' home. Yes, there was some republican legislation, like the lifting of the cap gains exclusion on homes to $500K (which fueled price inflation) and Glass-Steagall repeal, but the prime mover of this whole mess was liberal motivations, and later GWB, to get poor people in homes but make the private sector pay for it. Low interest rates didn't help either. This was a bubble created by public policy.

    It's a dumb idea to try and get the market to give poor people loans. When forced, the the market will respond in a distorted and dumb way because somehow, some way, the market will try and put lipstick on that pig and make money. Wall street brainiacs found a way by golly, but in doing so created a monster far larger than the initial problem- Unintended consequences. In 1997, Bear Stearns did the first securitization of CRA loans, a $384 million offering guaranteed by Freddie Mac. I didn't hear any cries of how bad republican deregulation was from the queen bitch Pelosi then. The smart insiders knew this was shit but they also had to make money, why else would they create the CDS market and these type of new securities?

    If liberals want poor people in homes, then they should have put forth a direct lending program under full gov't supervision so that the cost was upfront and known. The political types could trumpet increased home ownership, but seemingly didn't have to pay for it, typical free lunch thinking. But also typical that they blame republicans, and typical that it sells. Very depressing, the slide into socialism goes without a fight.
     
  2. Yes, It is sad.

    It all comes down to PR. The Republicans starting with Bush are awful in getting public support and understanding for their programs. Part of that is the media not cooperating.
    Iraq was never redefined after finding no nukes, big mistake.
    Why has Chaney become a villain. He should be out there talking about how he works with Bush. Its the mystery that victimizes him.

    McCain has done a terrible job explaining sub prime, obama tax program and many others.
     
  3. Mav88

    Mav88

    As the social welfare budgets, along with this bailout spending, start to strangle the government budget, I am willing to bet that that liberals will successfully blame repubs.

    It's not that I am a republican, it's that liberals won't accept responsibility for their failed ideas while they are tremendously good at repackaging and selling the same old shit.

    Obama is nothing new, change my ass.
     
  4. Democrats are sumptin' else... they definitely are the root cause of the subprime mess. There are no two ways about it. When they are questioned in public they will do a shout down lasting up to 90 seconds, long enough for the audience to forget the question and to instead applaud their shout down performance, or a quieter form of the same thing where they talk and just never answer the question, usually they redirect blame, typically with no supporting facts at all... the Conservative position is much harder to articulate seemingly but McCain's answer to all of Obama's programs [money handouts in return for votes] was "the best program is a good job".. Republicans should find some simple ideas that are simple to remember and repeat and just stick to that... and the "change" word is making me jump out of my skin nowadays, we had that same drumbeat in the Clinton years and it's causing a world wide calamity currently...
     
  5. Mav88

    Mav88

    Dems, like pubs, can be broken down into several groups.

    Their smartest group, the liberals and leftists, know this but don't care. They lack intellectual honesty because their agenda is 'anything but republican', socialism, and to them the ends justifies the means. Therefore they just don't care if Clinton, Frank, and company are laying waste the US economy and then lie about it. As long as in the end their world view gains favor.

    Their dumbest group, mostly inner city people and uneducated immigrants, can't care. They don't understand it. The demo message definitely plays well among the dumb, by a 2-1 margin people without a high school diploma prefer demos. Pretty obvious when the demo message is simply 'we'll get you some gov't cash, never mind how'.

    What I can't figure out is why Obama got a bump up from the crisis from independents. He didn't do shit, in fact blocked a senate bill in 05. Think about it- Democrats created this shit, blocked regulating it, and then led the congresional bailout bill that was very unpopular among the electorate. Republicans were the main opposition to the unpopular bailout, YET Obama gets a bounce up! Demos had a very cynical and crass vote counting going on in the house during bailout voting. The Black Caucus, and some of Frank's own demo committee members voted against the bill he pushed -yet he and cunt Pelosi blame Repubs, and it sells. They must be gleeful behind closed doors, this is like campaigning to retards.

    Repubs actually look bad blocking a bill that noone wanted in the first place, then in typical republican fashion scurry away and lick their wounds. While the brainless Demo shoutdowns continue.

    These people have no principles other than lust for power and advancing a leftist agenda no matter what the consequences. It's a political knife fight and the good guy will lose.
     
  6. Mav88

    Mav88

    Democrats are sumptin' else... they definitely are the root cause of the subprime mess. There are no two ways about it. When they are questioned in public they will do a shout down lasting up to 90 seconds, long enough for the audience to forget the question and to instead applaud their shout down performance, or a quieter form of the same thing where they talk and just never answer the question, usually they redirect blame, typically with no supporting facts at all... the Conservative position is much harder to articulate seemingly but McCain's answer to all of Obama's programs [money handouts in return for votes] was "the best program is a good job".. Republicans should find some simple ideas that are simple to remember and repeat and just stick to that... and the "change" word is making me jump out of my skin nowadays, we had that same drumbeat in the Clinton years and it's causing a world wide calamity currently...

    Populist politics doesn't lend itself to complicated ideas, our universities push leftist agendas, and many people are simply too dumb or lazy to do a little reading and thinking.

    Conservative/libertarian ideas really don't sell well period. Religious nutjobs hijacked them, country clubbers don't help, and most people will want to join in the gov't cash grab anyway.

    Demo ideas sell well initially, but then later when things get fucked up is when they have learned this blame deflection process and have gotten good at it. Take a local issue- schools. Inner city schools always need more money, a favorite issue among liberals. In my area, Dayton, Ohio the Dayton system already gets more per student than the area average, but always underperform. A few years ago when they got a big increase the left sold it as 'the solution'. Long since forgotten, now they want more money again and if you oppose it that means you don't care about kids and education. The conservative message, like what values and motivations the kids bring to school matters how much money you throw at them won't make a difference, doesn't sell at all.

    The demos pushing fannie into risky subprimes and the repubs asking for regulation is long forgotten now, the answer is more of the same shit from the people who brought you this mess. It's hard to push for freedom when the people who fucked up the free markets get to escape any blame and it turn it around 180 degrees succcessfully.

    Democrats win, we all lose.
     
  7. This is the most accurate ET thread ever. Every single time democrats are put on the spot they literally blame the free market republicans. They say we are in this mess because of deregulation from a conservative ideology that actually came about under the Clinton administration.

    As for independants, they are so moderate that they cannot distinguish who is to blame for this mess mainly because of the media. Also McCain is about as persuasive as a passive preschool girl. If he had the ability of turning his critical attitude into critical debate statements than he might have a much larger chance.

    The bottom line is if you ask any liberal who is not a highschool dropout who is to blame for the economy they will not be able to give you one piece of specific information.
     
  8. What we are seeing is the result of tax cuts at all costs, deficet spending doctrine and deregulation policy brought in by your hero Ronald Reagan. The once fiscally conservative republician party drank the Reagan coolaid and that more than anything else is what helped bring us to this point. Starting with Bush 41 and then Clinton, America enjoyed prosperity, growth and a balanced budget. The far right brainwashed with Jesus, the flag and basic tribalism couldn't stand the prosperity and so brought in Bush 43. The greater threat to our economy, wealth and security right now is the Republican party. Where are we at now? What has the republican leadership and basic republican mindset brought us. We are hated and or mistrusted around the world, the job market is getting worse, the deficit well that is a joke. The biggest penality we are going to have to suffer that the republicans have left us, will be our bankrupt government and worthless dollar. And you read on this thread and how we need 4 more years of this with McCain/Palin. Somebody is good at deflecting blame and it is the republicans also known as the new socialist party.
     
  9. Sure, the Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter policy left quite a legecy. I will take post-Carter any day over pre-Carter.
     
  10. You don't understand. Reagan made deficit spending a conservative philosophy. To the new republicans Reagan made spending more than you make as being conservative. Deregulation became a religion and not a policy decision. Tax cuts became a religion and not a policy decision. I don't think Reagan would approve of what the republican party has done in his name.
    Kennedy was the right man for the job and was what America needed at that time.
    Lumping Kennedy with Nixon and Johnson and Carter is just ignorant. Nixon is in a class by himself.
    Ford was good except for his pardoning of Nixon.
     
    #10     Oct 12, 2008