Career advice for salaried worker

Discussion in 'Professional Trading' started by WorkingSlave, Jan 6, 2010.

  1. The health aspect is an excellent point. I had the opposite experience weight-wise though, I think when I worked in under two years I gained (!) over 25 pounds. I used to be very active outdoors, I went to the gym a lot, but once I started working I just felt so burned out from all the traveling, hotel living, airport-waiting-for-missed-flights that the only thing I was looking forward to was sleeping as much as possible during the weekends. My then girlfriend was complaining "Oh now you're finally at home, and all you wanna do is sleep". "Shut up, you don't know what you're talking about" would be a typical exchange.

    I think some of the many monologues in Fight Club (the movie) capture the feeling perfectly where the narrator explains his sleep-deprived lifestyle. The feeling of being a zombie.

    From an eating point of view, during the week, as an office-type worker you are pretty much forced to eat industrial food, junk food or engage in the late-night "social" corporate dinners. IMO terrible from a health point of view, especially when you feel too dead to do any exercise in your time off. Anyone remember those glossy corporate human resource marketing brochures that they hand out on the campus days "Our company values finding a balance between work and your life outside of the office". Yea, right :cool:

    What a difference time gained from independence can make. I can spend hours shopping food every week now. Driving to different stores/markets just so I can get the specific organic produce I want. Now I can spend an hour preparing lunch with fresh fish/organic meats and fresh veg while watching TV and then hit my own gym in my home for another hour and watch some more Bloomie. To me, this is the ultimate luxury, much more than any MTV crib list of material goodies: working when I want, spending as many hours on one's own well-being as I want, sleeping when and as long as I want without any outsiders (corporate clowns) dictating the schedule.
     
    #21     Jan 7, 2010
  2. IB analyst, as I thought. You make about as much as a McDonalds manager on an hourly basis. Hmm, I wonder which firm, I'm guessing possibly Goldman since it's downtown. Or maybe DB.

    Anyway, the reality is that you are not going to make anywhere near 80k as a daytrader. Likely scenario is that you make nothing for 1-2 years, then maybe hit consistent profitability, then maybe start making significant money. I do not know what your friend is offering you at his "prop" firm but I think it's the standard put down $5k and you're hired.

    You need to realize that unless you're getting hired by FNYS which pays a salary, you will be living off your savings while learning to trade. You will start missing your paychecks. You will doubt the decision you made when you have bad days. It is a much tougher trading environment now than it was years ago.

    If you signed a 2 year employment contract, you're close to its end. If you do not get offered a 3rd year, which it sounds like you won't since you do not like the job, you should be getting a severance package. If you still want to try your luck at trading do so, but do not throw all your eggs in one basket. Sounds like you have some decent capital saved up, take a look around at other opportunities and business ventures. Maybe a startup or new PE firm, stuff like that.
     
    #22     Jan 7, 2010
  3. anything you overdo you will get burned out from, put yourself in trading, going at it trying to make money for 6 days a week 10 hours, you'll hate trading as well.
    When I ran a business and made 6 figs per week, I Got burned out as well, even though I did no work, (bark out orders and run commands) it was just repetitive , human nature is lazy, money wasn't the issue in burning out or if you like or dislike the job.
    You must plow through burning out, make it an effort to exercise 2 hours daily and unload the stress.

    With everything you'll be burning out, its just a question of how much money will you be compensated.
    2. Be prepared for 2-3 years of no profits if you take trading, that is if you can quickly correct your own mistakes, if you don't you won't be profitable forever.

    This market preys on fear, robs on greed.


    Prop trading is not a job, Its a lifestyle.
     
    #23     Jan 7, 2010
  4. As opposed to sitting at home trading in front of multiple screens all day?

    Seriously, the concept of $80,000 annually trading on your own, is going to make you realize that very few reach that level. And currently, many of them who tried trading at home would take your job in a heartbeat.
     
    #24     Jan 8, 2010
  5. Police officer may be the last thing you wanted to be. The money is definitely good and you get to be well respected (when you have your gun and uniform).

    However, there is another side which I know, because I have a friend who is a police officer. Work shift is a nightmare. Police with less seniority gets the worst shift and the worst task. I don't think taking a mentally challenged homeless person to the shelter at 3am in the morning is the type of work you are looking for. Also, stopping a vehicle is always a life/death situation as you never know who you are stopping.

    When you don't have your guns and uniform, you would prefer to stay at home and hide.

    Anyway, I wish you good luck with your career/business. As I mentioned in the pm before, it's going to be tough, but I hope you are mentally ready for this.

    PA
     
    #25     Jan 8, 2010
  6. I would suggest you read
    "the IDIOT factor" , as well as
    "It's called work for a reason!" by the
    same author.

    Larry Winget has some very good advice.
     
    #26     Jan 8, 2010
  7. PM - If you want, I will send "you're broke because you want to be" by Winget.
     
    #27     Jan 8, 2010
  8. Yeah, I quit and basically was on the "poverty line" for about 6 months before I managed to raise enough capital to trade. I lived in a friend's loft (not a loft apartment, but an actual loft - no insulation or furniture, sleeping in a sleeping bag on the timbers, and a fan heater to keep the cold out) for £20 a week, and spent about £5 a week on pasta and tinned food, and probably another £20 a week on beer, and a fiver for a Financial Times subscription. Many people might think it would be a nightmare trying to live on £50 a week but actually you have pretty much all the essentials and I don't notice any major difference in quality of life or happiness compared to later years when I had reasonable money. Sex, socialising, public libraries, working out, and (nowadays) surfing the internet are basically free, after all.

    Once I had raised money and started trading, things were very nice, much better than working a job. The best thing is being able to have total work creativity - if you have an idea, you can implement it as soon as you do the work, and if it's a good one you will see results (that's the beauty of trading). You don't have to persuade some boss that it's a good move to risk customer money on this new technique you spotted but can't necessarily articulate sufficiently smoothly for the investment committee. At my prior job, a small trading firm, it was a nightmare trying to get them to do anything new. Another thing when you work for yourself at something you enjoy is you don't really notice the hours, because it's not "work". I used to catch the first train at around 5:15am, and get one back at 930pm after the US close, but I didn't really feel any problem with it. At that stage, when I had no savings, making £1k in a week or occasionally a day felt like a huge amount of money.

    If you are thinking of things like health benefits then maybe you just have the wrong mentality to go it alone. Most people in human history have not had health benefits, or even freedom from war, famine, government oppression and disease. There's this thing called risk and if you want to stay wrapped in a security blanket all your life, don't quit the corporate grind. No health benefit will save your ass from cancer or a heart attack, and if you look at most people they are fat fucks by 40 anyway. Quite why people think of health plans when they won't even eat and exercise properly, and booze and smoke, is beyond me. Just remember that the main security you are getting from an employer is the security of pissing away your life and freedom mostly for someone else's benefit. Someone to whom you are just a cog in a machine, easily replaced when your time is up. You only live once, so if you really want to work for yourself in a field you are passionate about, you should do it right now, not sit twiddling your thumbs.

    The problem with analysing the pros and cons is that there is inherent risk and insecurity in taking a chance. You can *never* be sure it will work out, and you are very unlikely to ever see a good opportunity that doesn't have a scary downside. Yet no one ever achieved something great without taking a risk or two along the way. When Caesar crossed the Rubicon he had no idea if he would succeed or end up being defeated, paraded through Rome and then executed - and in fact after getting the glory he ended up assassinated, and a failure as ruler. Yet he still went across, saying "Let the dice be cast" - he took the gamble. And gambling with some capital is a lot less nerve-wracking than gambling with your life. Most people aren't suited to it, as you can see from the negative replies on this thread.

    So, my recommendation would be stop analysing it, and look into your heart. Either you want it - *really* want it - or you don't. If you do, then analysis is irrelevant - just quit on Monday, hand in your notice immediately, and go for it. If that scares you too much then most likely you aren't committed enough to do it.
     
    #28     Jan 9, 2010
  9. Just remember that the main security you are getting from an employer is the security of pissing away your life and freedom mostly for someone else's benefit.
    -----------------------------

    The only issue I haven't resolved "yet" in this equation is the missing pension.

    I have the yardstick of my friends and family who have done the above (union workers, working for the state,etc) for comparisions and for the most part I have beat them in spades by being self employed and the opportunity to do what I want and how I do it but as they retire around me with a gaurenteed income, I'm not where I want to be and they have the luxury of a monthly check.
     
    #29     Jan 9, 2010
  10. Ok wait, so you quit your job at a small trading firm, then did god knows what to save money for starting capital to trade for yourself and then once you started trading, things magically and instantly changed for the better all around? Uhm, WHAT?
     
    #30     Jan 9, 2010