Any traders currently with Capital Traders Group in NYC? CTG I just received an email from them saying they will be under WTS management as of 5/1/13: "Dear Valued Traders, Please be advised that as of Today (May 1, 2013) Capital Traders Group will be under the direct management of WTS Proprietary Trading Group C/O Raymond Doyle. As of today, Please refer to Mr. Doyle with any and all questions or concerns regarding your account. You may contact Ray regarding information on your account" Does anyone have any further info on this? I am doing some digging but figured I'd throw it out there as well.
WTS is slowly taking over everybody in the Prop industry. Some firms that you think are not under WTS are going through WTS to get lower clearing cost due to the fact WTS has a capped clearing deal.
No I am not, I use to be in management at WTS before I left the prop world. If you are worried about WTS don't be, Keep your eyes on your fees to make sure they are right but besides that WTS is very stable and not a bad firm. Just make sure you monitor your fees to make sure they are not over charging and DON'T pay for their training it really is not worth it.
That "branch" was a total joke. I think they were doing some shaddy things like putting US guys at offshore firms. I wouldn't be surprised if WTS just pulled the plug on them and took it over to clean it up.
This is an interesting point. The same situation happened to the Boston, Philadelphia and Chicago branches. They were originally run by small firms but as the regulations became burdensome a lot joined broker-dealers as sub-groups. What we're seeing now is industry consolidation on-shore and more foreign firms opening up in jurisdictions that can keep operating costs down. I trade with WTS and have seen this going on since about 08/09. There doesn't seem to be much anyone can do about it. It's a result of higher overhead and a lot of competition. Once the smaller firms like CTG are completely gone, we should have around 1/2 a dozen well-capitalized firms and little to no smaller sub-groups. Trading off-shore is risky because these firms can be fly-by-night and you're pretty much shit out of luck if they decide to take your money and run. I don't see this trend changing. The same situation happened to the Boston, Philadelphia and Chicago branches. They were originally run by small firms but as the regulations became burdensome a lot joined broker-dealers as sub-groups. What we're seeing now is industry consolidation on-shore and more foreign firms opening up in jurisdictions that can keep operating costs down. I trade with WTS and have seen this going on since about 08/09. There doesn't seem to be much anyone can do about it. It's a result of higher overhead and a lot of competition. Once the smaller firms like CTG are completely gone, we should have around 1/2 a dozen well-capitalized firms and little to no smaller sub-groups. Trading off-shore is risky because these firms can be fly-by-night and you're pretty much shit out of luck if they decide to take your money and run. The series 56 harmed competition amongst prop firms. The new Dodd-Frank laws go into effect 2014 with stricter standards and much higher overhead for broker-dealers compared to earlier. The industry has really changed a lot.
A decade or two ago Schonfeld had done the same thing. Its survival of the fittest and small firms are vulnerable.
This has nothing to do with small firms and over regulation nor offshore competition. They were garbage subgroups trading on the WTS account that probably dropped enough volume or got in a hole with the main group and the owners quit. Thus wTS is left holding the bag. Did capital traders group ever even have an office that wasn't in WTS office space? I don't think so. This company is a conglamerate of junky internet branches which just had rebate traders that got sold a sales pitch. They weren't real traders, nor real companies to begin with.
That's a pretty serious accusation to make considering not one person has come forth and said they had a bad experience with this firm. As myself & other have indicated, this is most-likely consolidation. The smaller firms can not afford to run full-blown broker-dealers. The same thing has happened with JC Trading, Boston, Los Angeles and many other WTS branches. They typically present some type of merger or buy out. At least that's what the word around the water-cooler is. the CTG people ran a very clean shop and have had pretty good praise on the board. Not every firm blows out lol. The Boston branch at WTS was their most successful branch and they merged in as well. That is the result of over-regulation. The smaller firms can not afford to (with either money or manpower) keep up with the same regulatory requirements that Megabanks are required to do. It's somewhat naive to claim the regulatory climate has nothing to do with the consolidation in the industry. It is the root cause. It works that way for every type of industry including manufacturing, farming, local mom n pop shops, retailers, wholesalers, doctors, lawyers, etc. etc. As interest-driven regulatory changes occur, the regulators insist on the larger firms with sub-businesses operating as a chain or franchise type of situation where oversight is all centralized in the hands of a few. WTS has purchased many firms in the last year including Dimension and other broker-dealers. I definitely would not be surprised if that's the case. It's far more likely than the scenario you have proposed, SgtSlotter given the circumstances and the fact that CTG was WTS's most reputable branch. About two years ago CTG was offering 90/10 payout with 25 cents per 1k shares, free training, free series 56 training licensing etc for a $1500 deposit. I came up here and told the kids on board to jump on that deal because it won't last. Sure enough, it didn't. Similarly, I will tell everyone on here now to avoid smaller prop firms for the rest of the year because the dodd-frank laws go into effect this year and throughout 2014 and those new regulations mean the same for prop as they did for banking - the end of small business and the beginning of "too big to fail" prop firms. That is fact and disagreement would be the equivalent to what psychologists call "the I Refuse to Believe my government would do that" fallacy.
It may have something to do with the other email that WTS sent us out today: Dear Traders, Today weâre writing to let you know that as a firm weâve made a decision to move away from our current clearing relationship. The primary reason we are moving is so we can continue to offer you the best execution services in the industry. Unfortunately, our former clearing agent is significantly raising their rates â and we immediately went out to find a solution to continue to keep your costs as low as possible. We appreciate your patience during this transition process â as we expect to make the transition over the next several days. Although in the long term this will be a much better situation for you, we have worked very hard to minimize the inconvenience. What we are requiring you to do as of the time of this notice: ⢠No new option positions can be established; ⢠All options positions must be closed out by the end of trading tomorrow, 5/3; Until the migration is complete, we are requiring the following trading actions: ⢠All equity short positions must be closed out by the end of the day; ⢠No new overnight short positions can be established; ⢠We request that all accounts be as flat as possible at the end of each trading day until the migration is complete. Please know that we are employing our best efforts to provide you with the lowest-cost, best execution services. Your cooperation during this transition is greatly appreciated. Please join us on a conference call at 2:00 p.m. EST to address any issues or concerns. The call-in contact number is: Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-479-3208 Access code: 807 052 721 Thank you in advance, WTS PTG Management